America decisively wins 1812 war

JJohnson, you and General Zod seem determined to make statements on subjects which prove your utter ignorance of same.

The perfect example being your offering one right-wing editorial about a commission hearing in one of Canada's provinces as your 'proof' that Canada has no freedom of speech. And were there no abuses in the US judicial system in the last few years? I'm confident we could find hundreds easily and in very little time. I suppose you would conclude that the US is therefore also not free and woefully corrupt, yes?


As an alternative, Canada has NOTHING like this legal abomination which can still be used by any president during any crisis he chooses to: http://www.disastercenter.com/laworder/11490.htm
 
An American victory in an alternate War of 1812 (or 1807 or whenever you want to have it occur) is more of a political alternative than a military one. As has already been said, Canada was not that important to the British. They were willing to give it up in 1763 and 1781 but circumstances went the other way. If the US had done somewhat better than giving up Canada would have been the preferred option for the British government.

A few things that must be remembered was that America was not foaming at the mouth to conquer Canada. Canada was a victim of location. Any serious dispute between the US and UK inevitably included the American retort of "Well fine, then we'll just conquer Canada!" Canada was a political hostage and Britain knew this. There were serious talks of giving up Canada all the way into the 1860s during the settling of the Alabama claims. Getting rid of Canada would have made it easier for Britain to deal with the US and it was the free trade between the two nations that allowed both to prosper, not the political status of Canada.

Also, the New England threat to secede was overblown. The New England merchants were not happy with impressment or the wartime blockades of Continental Europe. It was the Embargo Act of 1807 put into place by Thomas Jefferson, an anti-Federalist/Republican, this wrecked New England's economy and infuriated the largely Federalist leaning politicians of the region. The secession threat was largely a political ploy aimed at Jefferson's hand picked successor Madison. Yet despite this large areas of New England voted for a declaration of war in 1812.

As for the French Catholic question...well its a joke. The anti-Catholic American Party was never more than a fringe group. Millions of Catholics immigrated to the US and despite prejudice did well for themselves and successfully integrated into American society. The Language barrier is also a big "so what?" Millions of Germans made the transition as did millions of Italians and millions of Spanish speakers are doing so even today. The French Canadians would have been integrated into American society within a few generations and would be a non issue in a short matter of time. (And even if I'm wrong, remember that the US Army used to be very good at unconventional warfare...just ask Tecumseh.)

Benjamin
 

The Sandman

Banned
The most important part of an American victory in the War of 1812 would be the mysterious prewar deaths of the bulk of the high-level officer corps, whose incompetence was the main reason we didn't just roll over Canada before the British could establish a solid defense.

There's also a definite element of time involved; if the US doesn't have Canada firmly under control by the beginning of the campaigning season in 1814, then the chances of a US victory go way down. If Canada was seen as completely lost, the British would be willing to swallow their pride rather than have to launch a major overseas invasion right after finally dealing with Nappy. If there's still enough of a foothold to allow the British to land safely, though, then they probably send over a sizeable force to take it back. Or alternatively send a sizeable force towards New Orleans and Mobile. Which in turn means that Jackson probably goes for Florida earlier in order to prevent the British from using that as a base (and so that in the post-war political arrangements the South gets a new state to balance Quebec).

The British probably keep Newfoundland; we don't have enough of a navy to hold it, and it isn't worth taking in the first place. And they may keep Nova Scotia, depending on just how long it takes us to put Halifax under siege and how much of the supplies have to be shipped in rather than brought overland.

A real funny side effect is that we probably take Cuba from the Spanish when the rest of their American empire rebels in 1821, since the South will be wanting another new state to balance the Maritimes. And Texas gets brought in as multiple states, or a state and multiple territories, to balance the rest of Canada.
 
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