Maybe a variation of the hypothetical East African Coast (2) and Indian (4) maps, albeit not as far south along the East African coast and expanding more into roughly the Balochistan region as well as the southern parts of Central Asia then into India proper?
Alternative Arabic Expansions
- Thread starter DanMcCollum
- Start date
Maybe a variation of the hypothetical East African Coast (2) and Indian (4) maps, albeit not as far south along the East African coast and expanding more into roughly the Balochistan region as well as the southern parts of Central Asia then into India proper?
If unable to expand much into south-west asia, and population or some other pressure still encourages large scale expansions, then the arabs will pretty much be forced by geography to expand a bit further into africa.This map of the modern day distribution of afro-asiatic languages looks like a good approximation of the maximum south-eastern extent they could reach. Any further south and considerably different climate necessitates different crops, livestock, and immune systems.
So how about this?
The north-eastern border could adjust considerably with wars with the romans and persians.
The south-western border is pretty arbitrarily drawn in the desert, I imagine arabs will control most permanent settlements, and nomadic muslim berbers might pledge allegiance to arab empires but be effectively independent.
The southernmost extent is determined by climate. Arabs might settle a bit further down the eastern coast though.
Various islands in the Atlantic, Mediterranean, and Indian might also be settled.
There is, of course, the possibility of following in the footsteps of a certain "al-Iskandar al-Akbar".
PhilippeO
Banned
If Byzantine-Sassanian not exhausted themselves in war, and Arab army failed to defeat them. there are several possibilities that Arabs could spread as citizens/settlers/foederati of both empires.
1) Arabs as Normans. failure of expansion cause new faith to collapse, and Arabs convert to Christianity / Zoroastrian and spread as Roman / Sassanian citizens. they join legion en-masse, ask for re-settlement in border province and spread in many cities inside both empires. Laksmid-Ghazanid land would be like Normandia, dominated by Arabs, but Arabs also spread beyond that. Arabs governor of Danube / Britannia ?
2) Arabs as Jews-Khazars. similar to above, but in this case Arabian Pennisula itself is held by strong Islamic government. the government of Arabia could be source of legislation, cultural pride, and threat against persecution.
1) Arabs as Normans. failure of expansion cause new faith to collapse, and Arabs convert to Christianity / Zoroastrian and spread as Roman / Sassanian citizens. they join legion en-masse, ask for re-settlement in border province and spread in many cities inside both empires. Laksmid-Ghazanid land would be like Normandia, dominated by Arabs, but Arabs also spread beyond that. Arabs governor of Danube / Britannia ?
2) Arabs as Jews-Khazars. similar to above, but in this case Arabian Pennisula itself is held by strong Islamic government. the government of Arabia could be source of legislation, cultural pride, and threat against persecution.
Yes, but to be stylistically correct and for the time, it would be Dhul-Qurnayn or he of the two horns.
Planet of Hats
Donor
I'm a sucker for Islamic Italy but I doubt it happens, so "down the Nile" or "down the east African coast" have my vote.
I think that in 3 and 4 you still need Persia for it to be more plausible.
This is actually the scenario that interests me the most, as well, since it seems fairly realistic and is also one which doesn't get used in many timelines (to my knowledge, at least!). I wonder how this state would develop and what impact a larger, and earlier, Muslim presence would have on Africa.
Deleted member 67076
The problem I see with this map is that the Arabs won't be getting past the Sudd. Extremely difficult, disease ridden, swampy terrain to cross until early modern logistics are formed, and theres no wealth to extract from the region.
Similarly, the Ethiopian highlands are a very tough nut to crack, although probably doable if overwhelming force is used.
Deleted member 67076
You'd essentially prevent the collapse (or recreate it after a brief collapse) of the Roman trading network centered around the Mediterranean. Ironically, much of southern Europe would remain very Antiquity-ish in culture (with a large Arab influence of course) and style for far longer and feudalism would be aborted in Italy and Spain.
"Ancient Arabia. A brief history and timeline" by Macdonald is available online and fairly good.