One question about Tarrantry. Is it an island that essentially replaces the Channel Islands? If not then these are almost certainly going to be part of her territory. Hmm, a Tarrantry reboot ...
IJN officers damn near assassinated the men who agreed to 5:5:3. It implied that Japan was less than the West. The Japanese navy despised it, the Treasury was, of course, much more receptive.
The Treaties benefited the RN the most because the Exchequer had no funds to engage in an arms race, but it had no choice than to do so if one arose, the idea of allowing the USN to dominate the seas was simply unthinkable at the time. The British had simply glorious designs, the G3 class BC was more or less the Iowa class fast battleship concept with portholes, but the cupboard was beyond bare. Any attempt to actually have built the G3 and the N3 battleships (now there was an ugly ass design, hard to believe the same country could come up with both ship types) would have bankrupt the UK and possibly caused either a far right or far left government to rise up (a Fascist or Communist UK is a rather unpleasant butterfly). The intense desire to keep the costs down extended all the way to the KGV class, which was pushed through with 14" guns in the hopes that it would result in future design limitations. The UK economy never really recovered from the cost of fighting WW I, with the Great depression coming along right on time to kill off the first signs of economic health.
While everyone fudged the Treaty limits, the UK was by far the most compliant. The Japanese treated the limitations as a challenge, something to be outwitted if not simply defied. The U.S. Congress, which was flush with cash and unwilling to release a extra nickel, was happy to follow the spirit of the rules while the Department of the Navy was playing its own cards in the cruiser classes.
Anything that is even mildly better from Slade's atrocious The Big One is bearable to me.
As it was Britain managed to get more out of their treaty limited KGVs than other nations got out of their mostly treaty breaking / Escelator claused 15" and 16" (and dare we say 18") designs.
Admiral Halsey
Banned
Have we run out of alternate warships to design?
I'm trying to come up with a decent one actually. It's an alternate first Dreadnought that was built by the USN instead of the RN.
My idea with that one is that the Laurier would not be getting into fistfights with other BBs but rather be a strong convoy escort and an absolute living hell to somebody on the shore. Considering the vast number of RN heavy units, I designed it with the idea that the RN will want to kill Kriegsmarine units themselves, so design it to blast the everloving shit out of anything it could possibly come across. If I were designing a BB, it would lose a 12" turret and the 8" turrets in favor of heavier belt armor. It should also be noted that the Laurier's belt number is average, it's thicker around the machinery and main gun magazines, and it's got deck armor thicker than the KGV class and better AA protection, as well as similar torpedo protection.
Impractical, perhaps. But it would be the biggest weapon any troops near shore would have, and it would be a helluva weapon.
Have we run out of alternate warships to design?
Not me.
Type: Province-class Multirole Destroyer
Timeline(s): Canadian Power / Rise of the North / In Defense of Humanity / One Shot / The Land of Milk and Honey
And the Second such gem....
Type: Eagle-class Air Defense Cruiser
Timeline(s): Canadian Power / Rise of the North / In Defense of Humanity / One Shot / The Land of Milk and Honey
You modified the specifications of the Eagle-class cruisers later on remember?
sharlin
Banned
Ships for an AU and still existant Soviet Union post 1989.
Project 1144EM - Leonid Brezhnev - Commissioned August 1989.
This larger Kirov class Battlecruiser was built as the first of two additional ships for the Northern Fleet as the core of a powerful surface group, the second ship though was never laid down.
Displacement 24,280 tonnes fully loaded with a length of 252.1 meters.
Propulsion - Twin PWR reactors with oil-fired superheating boilers powering twin turbines for a maximum speed of 32 knots.
Armament.
40 VLS SS-N-19 but these could be swapped for the SS-N-27 Shuffle and SS-N-17 Snipe.
12 VLS for SS-N-21/24 SLCM cruise missiles.
24 x 6 VLS launchers for SA-N-12
6 x 8 VLS for SA-N-9
1 x RBU-6000
2 x RBU-1200
5 x CADS-N-1
Two Quintuple 21-inch torpedo tubes with Type 80 Dual role torpedoes and capacity for SS-N-15.
The new SA-N-12 was a navalised version for the SA-20 Gargoyle and the fire control radars were the 'Cross Flap' type, the 'Sky Watch' 3D system was also fitted although initially inactive due to ongoing software problems.
In 2004 the ship as Fleet Command ship Norther Fleet was extensively refitted, with the 'Flat Watch' 3D radar system, under development from 1995 replaced the failed and unreliable 'Sky Watch'. The SA-N-17 and SA-N-15 missiles replaced the SA-N-9 and SA-N-12 respectively whilst only the SS-N-17 missile was the standard anti-ship missile but eight SS-N-27 were also carried. The ship also recived a new ECM and ESM system during the refit.
SS-N-21 'Sampson' Developed in 1984 as a naval version of the AS-15 'Kent' and is analogious of the USN's Tommahawk missile. Capable of carrying a 150kt warhead or a 450kg HE arhead out to 2700km. The Soviet Union refitted a total of 32 vessels with launch capabilities for the SS-N-21 in place of SS-N-14/9/22 to give a supprise tactical abilty to hit a target at extreme range.
All nuclear warheads for this missile system were decomissioned in 1999.
SS-N-17 'Snipe' A deeply secret project that was not revealed to the West until 1994 the SS-N-17 is a ramjet powered ASM. Launched by a rocket the missile was then powered by a ducted rocket engine, a kind of ramjet more powerful and efficient than a pure rocket.
Capable of carrying either a 50kt warhead of a 250kg warhead to over 1500 km at the jaw dropping speed of M6.5 wave skimming at 20 meters all the way the SS-N-17 was a 'game changer' when its details were known.
The Kirov class ships carried four of these missiles in place of SS-N-19's in 1997 a full passive guidance system was fitted with Glosnass references and passive radar homing as well as home on jam. By 1995 it had replaced all SS-N-12s and 19's on surface vessels.
SS-N-27 'Shuffle' entering service in 1990 the Shuffle is an improved supersonic SS-N-19 with a M3.5 terminal stage. Cruising at 50 meters until it reaches 15km from a target. At this point the missile boosts to mach 3.5 and drops to 25 meters with a terminal pop up for its 700kg warhead. Range is 155 miles.
Project 2235 Gorshkov Class Destroyer - 24 built between 2000 - 2012
This powerful new class of destroyers was built for the Northern and Pacific Fleets for surface attack groups.
Displacement - 12000 tonnes standard
Dimensions 145.7 meters long, 20.7 meters wide, 6.25 meters deep
Propulsion - COGOG system with a maximum speed of 33kts.
Armament
1 x Dual AK-130
VLS for 16 x SS-N-25
VLS for 8 x octuple SA-N-16 'Gorgon' SAM.
VLS for 4 x octuple SA-N-17 'Glitter' SAM.
2 x CADS-N-2
1 x RBU-6000
Two recessed Quadruple 21inch torpedo tubes firing Type-97 torpedoes or SS-N-15
The hangar aft can hold two KA-40 Hellas Helicopters
Radars - 'Flat Watch' 3D and 'Strut Pair-II' air/surface search.
Two 'Palm Frond II' and one 'Kite tower' targetting/aquisition radar
Two 'Cross Place' and two 'Dome Ball' SAM fire control radar.
'Horse Jaw' Sonar as well as a 'Stallion Tail' VDS.
SS-N-25 'Skorpion' - nicknamed the 'Harpoonski' in the west due to its similarities with the Western missile the SS-N-25 entered service in 1987 as a light weight short ranged weapon as well as being capable of being carried on aircraft where it is know as the AS-20. Fitted with a 54kg HE warhead the missile cruises at M0.9 and features a 10-15 meter waveskimming capacity out to 130km.
SA-N-16 'Gorgon' Developed in 2006 as a replacement for the SA-N-7 the SS-N-16 is based on the land based SA-23 system and is reported to be ABM capable. The missile has a maximum range of 200 km.
SA-N-17 'Glitter' Developed in 2005 as the replacement for the SA-N-9 the Glitter is of similar in size and indeed uses the SA-N-9 body for its design but is fitted with a bigger booster stage as well as an improved sustainer for a maximum range of 65km.
Project 1144EM - Leonid Brezhnev - Commissioned August 1989.
This larger Kirov class Battlecruiser was built as the first of two additional ships for the Northern Fleet as the core of a powerful surface group, the second ship though was never laid down.
Displacement 24,280 tonnes fully loaded with a length of 252.1 meters.
Propulsion - Twin PWR reactors with oil-fired superheating boilers powering twin turbines for a maximum speed of 32 knots.
Armament.
40 VLS SS-N-19 but these could be swapped for the SS-N-27 Shuffle and SS-N-17 Snipe.
12 VLS for SS-N-21/24 SLCM cruise missiles.
24 x 6 VLS launchers for SA-N-12
6 x 8 VLS for SA-N-9
1 x RBU-6000
2 x RBU-1200
5 x CADS-N-1
Two Quintuple 21-inch torpedo tubes with Type 80 Dual role torpedoes and capacity for SS-N-15.
The new SA-N-12 was a navalised version for the SA-20 Gargoyle and the fire control radars were the 'Cross Flap' type, the 'Sky Watch' 3D system was also fitted although initially inactive due to ongoing software problems.
In 2004 the ship as Fleet Command ship Norther Fleet was extensively refitted, with the 'Flat Watch' 3D radar system, under development from 1995 replaced the failed and unreliable 'Sky Watch'. The SA-N-17 and SA-N-15 missiles replaced the SA-N-9 and SA-N-12 respectively whilst only the SS-N-17 missile was the standard anti-ship missile but eight SS-N-27 were also carried. The ship also recived a new ECM and ESM system during the refit.
SS-N-21 'Sampson' Developed in 1984 as a naval version of the AS-15 'Kent' and is analogious of the USN's Tommahawk missile. Capable of carrying a 150kt warhead or a 450kg HE arhead out to 2700km. The Soviet Union refitted a total of 32 vessels with launch capabilities for the SS-N-21 in place of SS-N-14/9/22 to give a supprise tactical abilty to hit a target at extreme range.
All nuclear warheads for this missile system were decomissioned in 1999.
SS-N-17 'Snipe' A deeply secret project that was not revealed to the West until 1994 the SS-N-17 is a ramjet powered ASM. Launched by a rocket the missile was then powered by a ducted rocket engine, a kind of ramjet more powerful and efficient than a pure rocket.
Capable of carrying either a 50kt warhead of a 250kg warhead to over 1500 km at the jaw dropping speed of M6.5 wave skimming at 20 meters all the way the SS-N-17 was a 'game changer' when its details were known.
The Kirov class ships carried four of these missiles in place of SS-N-19's in 1997 a full passive guidance system was fitted with Glosnass references and passive radar homing as well as home on jam. By 1995 it had replaced all SS-N-12s and 19's on surface vessels.
SS-N-27 'Shuffle' entering service in 1990 the Shuffle is an improved supersonic SS-N-19 with a M3.5 terminal stage. Cruising at 50 meters until it reaches 15km from a target. At this point the missile boosts to mach 3.5 and drops to 25 meters with a terminal pop up for its 700kg warhead. Range is 155 miles.
Project 2235 Gorshkov Class Destroyer - 24 built between 2000 - 2012
This powerful new class of destroyers was built for the Northern and Pacific Fleets for surface attack groups.
Displacement - 12000 tonnes standard
Dimensions 145.7 meters long, 20.7 meters wide, 6.25 meters deep
Propulsion - COGOG system with a maximum speed of 33kts.
Armament
1 x Dual AK-130
VLS for 16 x SS-N-25
VLS for 8 x octuple SA-N-16 'Gorgon' SAM.
VLS for 4 x octuple SA-N-17 'Glitter' SAM.
2 x CADS-N-2
1 x RBU-6000
Two recessed Quadruple 21inch torpedo tubes firing Type-97 torpedoes or SS-N-15
The hangar aft can hold two KA-40 Hellas Helicopters
Radars - 'Flat Watch' 3D and 'Strut Pair-II' air/surface search.
Two 'Palm Frond II' and one 'Kite tower' targetting/aquisition radar
Two 'Cross Place' and two 'Dome Ball' SAM fire control radar.
'Horse Jaw' Sonar as well as a 'Stallion Tail' VDS.
SS-N-25 'Skorpion' - nicknamed the 'Harpoonski' in the west due to its similarities with the Western missile the SS-N-25 entered service in 1987 as a light weight short ranged weapon as well as being capable of being carried on aircraft where it is know as the AS-20. Fitted with a 54kg HE warhead the missile cruises at M0.9 and features a 10-15 meter waveskimming capacity out to 130km.
SA-N-16 'Gorgon' Developed in 2006 as a replacement for the SA-N-7 the SS-N-16 is based on the land based SA-23 system and is reported to be ABM capable. The missile has a maximum range of 200 km.
SA-N-17 'Glitter' Developed in 2005 as the replacement for the SA-N-9 the Glitter is of similar in size and indeed uses the SA-N-9 body for its design but is fitted with a bigger booster stage as well as an improved sustainer for a maximum range of 65km.
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I'll let you know in the future.
Most of the ships I'm interested in are of the interwar and WWII period, and then the general post-WWII period, including an ATL present day (with technology levels comparable to contemporary OTL). Also, can you design/calculate patrol boats and civilian ships with that piece of software ?
This is the Bangalore class light cruiser.
Laid down in 1945, the ship and its planned 1946 sister Karachi will form the heavy screening elements for the aircraft carrier Trishula (found somewhere up this thread).
She mounts four twin automatic 150mm guns as her main battery. The navy was uncomfortable with relying on these somewhat novel weapons to provide heavy air defence fire, so a battery of 125mm guns and the standard 57mm guns are also included.
Belt armor is 150mm, deck armor averages 65mm. Top speed is 33 knots, with a range of 15,000 nm @ 15 knots.
I happen to think she'd look pretty snazzy after a mid-life refit to replace the aft battery with Terrier-style SAM systems...
Laid down in 1945, the ship and its planned 1946 sister Karachi will form the heavy screening elements for the aircraft carrier Trishula (found somewhere up this thread).
She mounts four twin automatic 150mm guns as her main battery. The navy was uncomfortable with relying on these somewhat novel weapons to provide heavy air defence fire, so a battery of 125mm guns and the standard 57mm guns are also included.
Belt armor is 150mm, deck armor averages 65mm. Top speed is 33 knots, with a range of 15,000 nm @ 15 knots.
I happen to think she'd look pretty snazzy after a mid-life refit to replace the aft battery with Terrier-style SAM systems...
Yes to both, but anything smaller than about 50 tons is quite difficult. And you have to use miscellaneous weight for any rocket/missile weapons... SS allows a laydown date of 1950 at the latest.
Are you aware there's a Polish Blog whose owner does Springsharp designs for Poland, mostly from 1860 to about 1905? The site is polish but the designs are in english...
Thank you, I might have a look at them. The Polish ships of my TL won't be a drastic departure from OTL ones in terms of capability, but without East Block era influences, some developments and virtually all types might not look the same.
HMCS Creed Escort Carrier
Length 500 feet
Flight deck 500 x 100 feet
Displacement 8,000 tons
Max speed 25 knots
Aircraft 24
Lifts 2
Named after the Canadian-born electrical engineer William G. Creed who applied for one of the first patents on catamarans.
Frustrated by slow Royal Navy re-armament during the 1930s, Canadian Prime Minister W.L.MacKenzie King commits the Royal Canadian Navy to convoy escort duties. Canadian shipyards build hundreds of corvettes and three dozen escort carriers.
These cat-carriers have distinctive catamaran hulls. They have only two decks amid-ships: hangar and accommodations. Hulls are unusually deep and narrow. Their greater draft makes them more stable in heavy seas, reducing crew fatigue and easing landing-on. The other factor easing landing-on is the much wider flight deck. Since the elevators were an after-thought, they were added amidships-port and starboard-aft. Pilots soon learn the "lean to port" when landing on, reducing the number of barrier strikes.
Their lighter displacement gives them better dash-speed when maneuvering to land-on airplanes.
General Raymond Collishaw is seconded from the Royal Air Force to head the new Royal Canadian Fleet Air Arm. He begins with a handful RCAF personnel and airplanes declared surplus by the RCAF. The RCAF was glad to rid itself of Blackburn Shark torpedo planes, which proved ideal for teaching landing-on skills.
The RCAF was equally glad to rid itself of the Grumman Goblin 2-seater fighters built by Canadian Car and Foundry in Fort William, Ontario. CCF only built one batch of biplane fighters and soon converted their production line to building wing sets for Grumman.
By mid-war, RCNVR escort carriers mainly carried Grumman Avengers armed with radar and rockets. RCNVR Avengers scored a few initial histories, but U-boats soon learned to steer well clear of convoys accompanied by escort carriers.
By 1944, Grumman had developed a big-wing version of the Avenger specifically for convoy escort duties.
Meanwhile, RAF Bomber Command repeatedly requested more aircrew from Canada.
Length 500 feet
Flight deck 500 x 100 feet
Displacement 8,000 tons
Max speed 25 knots
Aircraft 24
Lifts 2
Named after the Canadian-born electrical engineer William G. Creed who applied for one of the first patents on catamarans.
Frustrated by slow Royal Navy re-armament during the 1930s, Canadian Prime Minister W.L.MacKenzie King commits the Royal Canadian Navy to convoy escort duties. Canadian shipyards build hundreds of corvettes and three dozen escort carriers.
These cat-carriers have distinctive catamaran hulls. They have only two decks amid-ships: hangar and accommodations. Hulls are unusually deep and narrow. Their greater draft makes them more stable in heavy seas, reducing crew fatigue and easing landing-on. The other factor easing landing-on is the much wider flight deck. Since the elevators were an after-thought, they were added amidships-port and starboard-aft. Pilots soon learn the "lean to port" when landing on, reducing the number of barrier strikes.
Their lighter displacement gives them better dash-speed when maneuvering to land-on airplanes.
General Raymond Collishaw is seconded from the Royal Air Force to head the new Royal Canadian Fleet Air Arm. He begins with a handful RCAF personnel and airplanes declared surplus by the RCAF. The RCAF was glad to rid itself of Blackburn Shark torpedo planes, which proved ideal for teaching landing-on skills.
The RCAF was equally glad to rid itself of the Grumman Goblin 2-seater fighters built by Canadian Car and Foundry in Fort William, Ontario. CCF only built one batch of biplane fighters and soon converted their production line to building wing sets for Grumman.
By mid-war, RCNVR escort carriers mainly carried Grumman Avengers armed with radar and rockets. RCNVR Avengers scored a few initial histories, but U-boats soon learned to steer well clear of convoys accompanied by escort carriers.
By 1944, Grumman had developed a big-wing version of the Avenger specifically for convoy escort duties.
Meanwhile, RAF Bomber Command repeatedly requested more aircrew from Canada.