Alexander II doesn't get assasinated

I don't think Alexander would have gone as far as to make a constitution. The Constitution you have seems a little too liberal for the period, such as women joining the army and holding public office. Also, the Polish never liked Alexander's reforms- see the Janurary Uprising.
 
I don't think Alexander would have gone as far as to make a constitution. The Constitution you have seems a little too liberal for the period, such as women joining the army and holding public office. Also, the Polish never liked Alexander's reforms- see the Janurary Uprising.


Yes but it really isn't a constitution, you see Alexander knew that people wanted constitution so he decided to make a constitution that not only makes his people happy but also allows him to keep his absoulute power, He read Macciaveli and the king not only wins the affection of the people but keeps absoulute power for himself every monarchs dream fulfilled.
About the women... Well you see of course he was against it but the. He realized that if he allowed women such positions his manpower would drastically increase, where other countries use only men are at a disadvantage against the Russians because he knew that in times of war women were perfect to work in factories. Also most women at this time were really strong when you look at the peasants, and about public office he thought he could control women easier then men because remember at this time most women were submissive, so it is all part of his plan.

About the Poles, what he just did is made poles and other ethnicities the same rights as A Russian and he even decreased the terrible tax burden on the people, meaning Poles, Kazaks and others could hold high positions and vote something that was never given to Poles when tehy were independant so why when they enjoy all the benefits of a Russian and since life is wonderful they are living much better than when they were independant.
 
Conclusion

In 1885-1899

The British empire overan many of the sparsly populated French colonies in Africa while France was busy trying to stop the russian horde.

The Russian operation for the destruction of the Ottoman empire was called operation Constantine. The Russian troops taken from Kazaks, Quirats, former nomads and Eastern Russians made up a force of 500 artillary pieces and 2 million troops, they overan the caucasius, the Ottoman empire sent as many of it's troops to stop the Russian advance but it was futile an army of 1 million Russians and 300 artillary pieces attacked from the west and soon overan Ottoman control of Bulgaria and marched onto Constantinople, surrounded the Ottomans sued for piece but got back one reply Ottoman empire must give up Constantinople all of Georgia former area of Trebizond and Sinope as well as all trritory outside of Anatolia in fluxing Baghdad goes
to Britain and the Ottomans must become vassals of Russia or face complete and total destruction. The Ottoman sultan knew he had nor choice or else he would lose what little he had left, the Russians were within 50 miles of Constantinople, and they were storming through the middle east so infaturated with anger the Ottoman sultan signed the treaty. ( normally they would fight to the end but because the sultan was afraid and wary he accepted even though he could still fight. ) on September 11th 1888 the Ottoman empire surrendered and signed the treaty. Now only France and Germany stood alone. In January 1,1889 Germany sued for piece, they could not build a navy and were limited to a maximum army of 15000 soldiers.
France would also agreed but it was offered much harsher terms, the French navy was given to Russia, and all Italien possetions controlled by France goes to Italy and the medditeranian coast goes to Russia and France is reduced to pre 1300 borders for there empire. Naturally France decided to fight till the end. The Italiens overan Frances Medditeranian possestion, the Russians were marching just 50 miles from Paris and a British expedition force landed at Normandy and was overunning France. Soon After a bitter seige Paris fell to Russia in march 15th 1889 and then the Russians brutally slaughtered all in the city and turned Paris once the cultural center of the world was looted and it became a shell of it's former self. Soon France was divided into the Russian section, Italien section and British section. So the war ended and Europe would never be the same again. Meanwhile back in Russia Tsar Alexander was considered a demigod, people praised him and celebrations broke out across Russia and Britain. Then on December 12, 1889 Brtain and Russia signed the mutual defense agreement that if one nation was attacked the other would come to it's aid. However things were not okay, across the newly aquifer lands dissent grew. Soon Europe would be racked by rebbelions on an unprecedented scale, shattering the old world order forever....


I'll post next update in a while, but first anybfeesback kr comments on how the war went is appreciated and I hope this post isn't ASB or I will change it.
 
First of all, consider this as constructive criticism as I do like the idea of a successfully reforming Tsarist Russia very very much. Getting rid of communism always is a good thing too.

Now, let's start with a little list:

1. Despite your location in merry old England, pretty much every sentence has typing and grammatical errors in it, and big, fat, huge ones at that. So, for the love of Apollo and the nine muses, use a spell check and re-read before posting! It would do wonders for readability.

2. In short, too much, too soon. Late 19th century Imperial Russia is NOT 21st century Europe or USA, not even late nineteenth century France.

3. A constitution, fine, it's mostly a paper thing anyway. Right to a Pursuit of happiness? What the hell!!! A Russian constitution basically quoting the US declaration of independence would indeed qualify as ASB.

4. Freedom of speech and of press, nope, not going to happen. Less restrictions, yes, complete freedom, even if purely theoretical, no.

5. Free market, not completely, at least some protectionist measures, if only to protect the growing Russian industry against foreign competition.

6. The population voting for a new Tsar (technically speaking: Imperator & Autocrator), even if only at extinction of the direct line of succession, hell no!

7. Equal rights for women, don't even dare dreaming of it. More rights, yes, step, by step, equal rights and joining the army (WTF, nineteenth century remember) not before the 2nd half of the next century.

8. As mentioned, women being excluded is not due to Salic law but the Romanov House Law. I suppose you could change it to something like the British succession.

9. Russia starting a massive build up of the navy and a promise from the ambassador somehow convinces the UK that the Great Game is over? Eh, no. Might be possible, but not so easily and it would take many years of gradual thawing of relations.

10. I seriously doubt the Germans would help Russia modernise it's army. Germany does not like a very strong Russia, Bismarck certainly doesn't. Also, supporting what German unification, it happened a full decade ago already!

11. Ottoman wariness about Russia is pretty much the Sublime Porte's default mode, so nothing new there. Trying some reforms themselves, sure, though not the same ones and maybe not at the same level.

12. Austria getting pissed of at Prussia (you mean Germany), why? Nothing changed from OTL to make that happen. In fact, the only change being a Russia intent on becoming much more stronger would drive Austria and Germany closer together.

13. Freedom of religion is fine and perhaps doable, on paper. Getting the population to follow and to love and respect Jews just might take a little while longer...(say, a generation....or two)

14. Ottoman reforms backfiring, possible, though your proposed reforms for Russia would backfire even more.

15. A Russo-British alliance against Austria? What the hell? The only way for Austria to be at war with the UK would be as a tag-along to Germany.

16. What millions of new citizens? Russia suddenly becomes a country with chocolate rivers and gets a positive migration rate?

17. What growing anti-Semitism in Europe? (compared to OTL) Jews fleeing into Russia, even with religious freedom on paper, while in OTL they went away by the millions is just laughable. Einstein will live most of his life as a German, how he ends it depends on the existence or not of Nazi's or similar.

18. You do not get extremely prosperous as a nation in 3-4 years, you could be cruising to that direction at full steam though.

19. An Ottoman Sultan begging for Russian help must be truly desperate, I think they would try Britain & France first. Especially considering the hefty price Alexander demands. Which would also make the Sultan's life forfeit if he accepts, as well as making him look like a weakling that bows to Russia in the eyes of the Ottomans themselves. That and Constantinople would not have a land link to Russia, Romania sits in the way(independent since 1878). Bulgaria too but that is officially a tributary state to the Ottomans.

20. Britain would never, ever sign a treaty that obliges it to join someone in war when said someone starts the war himself. I suggest you try to look for another way to inflame Europe, shouldn't be *that* difficult in the age of nationalism. France & Germany in the same camp isn't exactly very likely either you know... Also note that a Russia with easy access to the Mediterranean is not in the best interests for the British.

21. your army numbers at times seem a bit off, aside from the typos with a 0 too few or too many.

22. I just noticed you have Russia looting, pillaging and slaughtering Paris. Such a barbarous act would make even the British vomit. Even with them being at war with France themselves.

23. This still could be a great TL after some serious polishing and shaving off of rough edges.
 
First of all, consider this as constructive criticism as I do like the idea of a successfully reforming Tsarist Russia very very much. Getting rid of communism always is a good thing too.

Now, let's start with a little list:

1. Despite your location in merry old England, pretty much every sentence has typing and grammatical errors in it, and big, fat, huge ones at that. So, for the love of Apollo and the nine muses, use a spell check and re-read before posting! It would do wonders for readability.

2. In short, too much, too soon. Late 19th century Imperial Russia is NOT 21st century Europe or USA, not even late nineteenth century Fra





3. A constitution, fine, it's mostly a paper thing anyway. Right to a Pursuit of happiness? What the hell!!! A Russian constitution basically quoting the US declaration of independence would indeed qualify as ASB.

4. Freedom of speech and of press, nope, not going to happen. Less restrictions, yes, complete freedom, even if purely theoretical, no.

5. Free market, not completely, at least some protectionist measures, if only to protect the growing Russian industry against foreign competition.

6. The population voting for a new Tsar (technically speaking: Imperator & Autocrator), even if only at extinction of the direct line of succession, hell no!

7. Equal rights for women, don't even dare dreaming of it. More rights, yes, step, by step, equal rights and joining the army (WTF, nineteenth century remember) not before the 2nd half of the next century.

8. As mentioned, women being excluded is not due to Salic law but the Romanov House Law. I suppose you could change it to something like the British succession.

9. Russia starting a massive build up of the navy and a promise from the ambassador somehow convinces the UK that the Great Game is over? Eh, no. Might be possible, but not so easily and it would take many years of gradual thawing of relations.
10. I seriously doubt the Germans would help Russia modernise it's army. Germany does not like a very strong Russia, Bismarck certainly doesn't. Also, supporting what German unification, it happened a full decade ago already!

11. Ottoman wariness about Russia is pretty much the Sublime Porte's default mode, so nothing new there. Trying some reforms themselves, sure, though not the same ones and maybe not at the same

12. Austria getting pissed of at Prussia (you mean Germany), why? Nothing changed from OTL to make that happen. In fact, the only change being a Russia intent on becoming much more stronger would drive Austria and Germany closer together.

13. Freedom of religion is fine and perhaps doable, on paper. Getting the
population to follow and to love and respect Jews just might take a little while longer...(say, a generation....or two)

14. Ottoman reforms backfiring, possible, though your proposed reforms for
Russia would backfire even more.

15. A Russo-British alliance against Austria? What the hell? The only way for Austria to be at war with the UK would be as a tag-along to Germany.

16. What millions of new citizens? Russia suddenly becomes a country with chocolate rivers and gets a positive migration rate?

17. What growing anti-Semitism in Europe? (compared to OTL) Jews fleeing into Russia, even with religious freedom on paper, while in OTL they went away by the millions is just laughable. Einstein will live most of his life as
a German, how he ends it depends on the existence or not of Nazi's or similar.

18. You do not get extremely prosperous as a nation in 3-4 years, you could be cruising to that direction at full steam though.

19. An Ottoman Sultan begging for Russian help must be truly desperate, I think they would try Britain & France first. Especially considering the hefty price Alexander demands. Which would also make the Sultan's life forfeit if he accepts, as well as making him look like a weakling that bows to Russia in th eyes of the Ottomans themselves. That and Constantinople would not have a land link to Russia, Romania sits in the way(independent since 1878). Bulgaria
too but that is officially a tributary state to the Ottomans.

20. Britain would never, ever sign a treaty that obliges it to join someone in war when said someone starts the war himself. I suggest you try to look for another way to inflame Europe, shouldn't be *that* difficult in the age of
nationalism. France & Germany in the same camp isn't exactly very likely either you know... Also note that a Russia with easy access to the Mediterranean is not in the best interests for the British.

21. your army numbers at times seem a bit off, aside from the typos with a 0 too few or too many.

22. I just noticed you have Russia looting, pillaging and slaughtering Paris.
Such a barbarous act would make even the British vomit. Even with them being at war with France themselves.

23. This still could be a great TL after some serious polishing and shaving off of rough edges.


Alright the typos were because sometimes I type to fast, but I Agree I shall make changes to the TL like you suggested. Ty for the critiscism now I can fix my mistakes so Ty:)
 
Guys for those of you following this Tl I will make a version 2.0 so this TL will not be updated:( But I hope you will all wait for me to recreate this timeline and make it completly different. Version 2.0 will be coming tommorow.:):)
 
Alright the typos were because sometimes I type to fast, but I Agree I shall make changes to the TL like you suggested. Ty for the critiscism now I can fix my mistakes so Ty:)
You know, I often make similar typos, especially when my keyboard can't follow my fingers, I just correct them before beginning my next sentence or even before I begin the next word so nobody gets to see them.:p

Also, I'd suggest a hefty use of wikipedia, it may have errors and be incomplete at times, but it can give a great overall view on things, including Imperial Russia.
 
Few points:
1) Russian Succession rules were chaotic until the Pauline Law of Paul I which introduced semi salic law (male only succession unless all male line dynasts were extinct).
In the 19th Century and early 20th century only monarchies that found themselves with a dearth of male heirs tended to change their succession rules. Alexander II has numerous sons and brothers so is unlikely to want to change the succession when there is no need.
2) Beatrice of the UK is the most unlikely marital choice for Nicholas II - she was born in 1857 and is therefore almost a decade older than Nicholas II. Queen Victoria was determined that "baby" wouldn't marry and she only caved in because Henry of Battenburg agreed to live in Britain. Apart from that Alexander II living longer would have meant that given his daughter's dissatisfaction with life in England he was unlikely to favour a British bride for his grandson, quite apart from Queen Victoria's personal prejudice's against Russia.
3) Assuming that Alexander II continues his pro imperial and more pro prussian policy (that Alexander III under the influence of his anti prussian danish wife favoured) then I wouldn't rule out Nicholas being pushed into marrying Princess Margaret of Prussia (sister of Wilhelm II) - one of the varying candidates mentioned for him in the 1880's. However Nicholas himself fell for Alix of Hesse and was pretty determined which combined with his father's failing health was perhaps the main reason that Alexander III and Marie Feodorovna caved in and gave their consent - in this timeline a German marriage without great political implications that was favoured by the Kaiser would probably be just as likely.
The main difference is that a Nicholas II succeeding Alexander II or succeeding a short reigning Alexander III is the difference it would have made to his education and the difference in the position he occupies on his accession.
4) Alexander II's assasination proved to Alexander III the pointlessness of reform and encouraged his views that Russia needed a strong autocratic leadership - without the assasination he might be drawn slightly closer to his father's move to reform. However he might also become a focus for opposition during the final years of his father's reign - they were already slightly estranged over his father's hasty remarriage to Princess Yurievsky (if Alexander II makes her Empress then there will be a major break) and particularly over foreign policy.
 
Few points:
1) Russian Succession rules were chaotic until the Pauline Law of Paul I which introduced semi salic law (male only succession unless all male line dynasts were extinct).
In the 19th Century and early 20th century only monarchies that found themselves with a dearth of male heirs tended to change their succession rules. Alexander II has numerous sons and brothers so is unlikely to want to change the succession when there is no need.
2) Beatrice of the UK is the most unlikely marital choice for Nicholas II - she was born in 1857 and is therefore almost a decade older than Nicholas II. Queen Victoria was determined that "baby" wouldn't marry and she only caved in because Henry of Battenburg agreed to live in Britain. Apart from that Alexander II living longer would have meant that given his daughter's dissatisfaction with life in England he was unlikely to favour a British

bride for his grandson, quite apart from Queen Victoria's personal prejudice's against Russia.
3) Assuming that Alexander II continues his pro imperial and more pro prussian policy (that Alexander III under the influence of his anti prussian danish wife favoured) then I wouldn't rule out Nicholas being pushed into marrying Princess Margaret of Prussia (sister of Wilhelm II) - one of the varying candidates mentioned for him in the 1880's. However Nicholas himself fell for Alix of Hesse and was pretty determined which combined with his father's failing health was perhaps the main reason that Alexander III and Marie Feodorovna caved in and gave their consent - in this timeline a German marriage without great political implications that was favoured by the Kaiser would probably be just as likely.
The main difference is that a Nicholas II succeeding Alexander II or succeeding a short reigning Alexander III is the difference it would have made to his education and the difference in the position he occupies on his accession
4) Alexander II's assasination proved to Alexander III the pointlessness of reform and encouraged his views that Russia needed a strong autocratic leadership - without the assasination he might be drawn slightly closer to his father's move to reform. However he might also become a focus for opposition during the final years of his father's reign - they were already slightly estranged over his father's hasty remarriage to Princess Yurievsky (if Alexander II makes her Empress then there will be a major break) and particularly over foreign policy.

Alright ill make those changes, but in my v2.0 Im planning for things to go a bit differently, really Alexander realizes the excellent use of Vassal states and Personal unions can be very benefitial and has plans to create a Rusia that dominates in Learning, technology, buisness, and culture. So yu guys should check out the v2.0
 

Stalker

Banned
"Your highness that rebel movement is gaining strenght, soon you may lose your life.
It's a blatant violation of the protocol. The Russian Tsar is adressed to as "Your Imperial Majesty".;)

In the Russian historiography this assasination is called "assasination of 1 March" and terrorists are called "pervomartovtsi" - "firstmarchers" because until 1917 Russia lived on the Julian calendary. There's a widely spread idea that Alexander II was killed on his way to signing the Draft Constitution but AFAIK, that was only a packet of wide economic and legal reforms submitted by the count Loris-Melikov.
BTW, right before his assasination, before he left palace, he had wild sex with his morganatic wife, Princess Yekaterina Dolgorukaya. He had her right on the dinner table and was so passionate in his loving that some historians even suspect as if he felt it was his last making love...
Many of the Alexander's domestic reforms were this or that way implemented by Alexander III but being a notorious Germanophobe, Alexander III started allying with France.
Probably, but for the assasination, we could have seen quite a different configuration on the Euroipean continent before WWI.
 
It's a blatant violation of the protocol. The Russian Tsar is adressed to as "Your Imperial Majesty".;)

In the Russian historiography this assasination is called "assasination of 1 March" and terrorists are called "pervomartovtsi" - "firstmarchers" because until 1917 Russia lived on the Julian calendary. There's a widely spread idea that Alexander II was killed on his way to signing the Draft Constitution but AFAIK, that was only a packet of wide economic and legal reforms submitted by the count Loris-Melikov.
BTW, right before his assasination, before he left palace, he had wild sex with his morganatic wife, Princess Yekaterina Dolgorukaya. He had her right on the dinner table and was so passionate in his loving that some historians even suspect as if he felt it was his last making love...
Many of the Alexander's domestic reforms were this or that way implemented by Alexander III but being a notorious Germanophobe, Alexander III started allying with France.
Probably, but for the assasination, we could have seen quite a different configuration on the Euroipean continent before WWI.

Check out V2 Its much better, and much more terrifing to the rest of the world, I will be updating that othread, but discussion is fine in this thread:p
 
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