Alexander Hamilton survives

What if Alexander Hamilton killed Burr and not that other way around, or he just didn't get killed during the duel. What would his survival do to American History if anything at all. Did he have a chance for President? I know he had some scandals before but could be make a comeback and be President or at least a influential senator?
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
I honestly doubt it. His political career was over the moment the Reynolds Scandal became public. He would have still been a major private influence on the Federalists, but they had been so thoroughly beaten by the Jeffersonians in 1800 that IOTL they never recovered as a political force. Would they have done better post-1804 if Hamilton had been alive? I don't think so.
 
That what i thought. I wanted to do a timeline with a POD of Hamilton surviving and becoming a President and see where it goes, but he was politically through. Maybe a POD of the Reynolds Scandal not being public until after his death?
 

Keenir

Banned
What if Alexander Hamilton killed Burr and not that other way around, or he just didn't get killed during the duel. What would his survival do to American History if anything at all. Did he have a chance for President? I know he had some scandals before but could be make a comeback and be President or at least a influential senator?

he'd be good for dragging people through the mud - or at least sleeping with female relatives of all and sundry. (its what he did in OTL - the man had more mistresses than Nelson)
 
That what i thought. I wanted to do a timeline with a POD of Hamilton surviving and becoming a President and see where it goes, but he was politically through. Maybe a POD of the Reynolds Scandal not being public until after his death?

The flaw with that timeline is that Alexander couldn't become President, he wasn't born in America, he was born in the west indies. However, I have always wondered what the rulling would be for someone born outside of the U.S., but then the U.S. later annexes that land. Would that allow Hamilton to become President?

If he did become president, he would be a rampant imperialist. He would want to expand in every direction. He was a very power hungry man. At least that is how they portrayed him in HBO's John Adams series.
 

Keenir

Banned
The flaw with that timeline is that Alexander couldn't become President, he wasn't born in America, he was born in the west indies.

was he living in the 13 Colonies when the Revolution took place? if so, he could be President.
(if not, he might try for Power Behind The Throne)

If he did become president, he would be a rampant imperialist. He would want to expand in every direction.

don't forget how Hamilton loved to boast of being related to Scottish royalty.

He could become the Rush Limbaugh of his day.

*whimpers*
 
The flaw with that timeline is that Alexander couldn't become President, he wasn't born in America, he was born in the west indies. However, I have always wondered what the rulling would be for someone born outside of the U.S., but then the U.S. later annexes that land. Would that allow Hamilton to become President?

If he did become president, he would be a rampant imperialist. He would want to expand in every direction. He was a very power hungry man. At least that is how they portrayed him in HBO's John Adams series.

I think being a General in the revolution and all his activities would allow him to be president if he could be elected. And that's the point, I want a America where the US goes imperialist crazy. :D The only thing is is he was a anglophile, so he wouldn't be getting us in the war of 1812, but disrupting the US trade mught be enough for him too.
 

Eurofed

Banned
The flaw with that timeline is that Alexander couldn't become President, he wasn't born in America, he was born in the west indies.

I don't remember the exact text, but the framers wrote a loophole about this, since very few would have qualified as natural-born when the Constitution was written. After all, there wasn't a USA until it was ratification.
 
I don't remember the exact text, but the framers wrote a loophole about this, since very few would have qualified as natural-born when the Constitution was written. After all, there wasn't a USA until it was ratification.

No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

There you go.

EDIT: Oh, and technically, the USA is older than the current Constitution. The Articles of Confederation actually established the Union.
 
The flaw with that timeline is that Alexander couldn't become President, he wasn't born in America, he was born in the west indies.

This does not apply to Hamilton. The Constitution says The President must be a natural born US citizen, or a US citizen at the time The Constitution was adopted.

Also being born in The USA is not the only way to be a natural born US citizen. If either of your parents is a US citizen at the time of your birth, then you are natural born US citizen.

The thing of being born in The USA came in with The 15th Amendment ratified in 1868. It was done to make sure African-American former slaves could not be denied US citizenship. Since by then almost all former slaves were born here, it was an easy way to make sure they were counted as US citizens.

Before 1868 the only way to be a natural born US citizen was for one of your parents to be a US citizen at the time of your birth. This rule still applies. If a US couple expecting a baby is on vacation in some other country and the wife gives birth there, the baby is automatically a natural born US citizen because the parents were US citizens at the time the baby was born.
 
I started a thread on a similar theme earlier on this year President Hamilton an academic question? He could in theory have recovered his popularity possibly due to the unpopularity on the Embargo Act. The word Hamitonian might have been adopted for strong non socialist federal government giving it a better name. i.e Lincoln, the 2 Roosevelts, Harry Truman and Lyndon Johnson could be called Hamiltonians
 
I could not see the Federalists doing any worse with Hamilton than in OTL. Of course, if Burr is killed in the duel Hamilton may very well go to court (as dueling is illegal in both New York and New Jersey by that time) and face a murder conviction. If Burr lives, one might presume the two make amends (much akin to Jefferson and Adams) and resume a somewhat cordial correspondance. This may seem far-fetched, but weirder things have happened in history and the two were once close friends and business partners.

Otherwise, Hamilton's abilities as an organizer and schemer would likely improve the Federalist party's performances in 1804, 1808, and 1812 (this latter date being especially important as it was the Federalist Party's best chance to retake the White House). Moreover, with more Federalists in the House and Senate, war with Britain might well be avoided (the motion passed by a very slim margin) and the infamous Hartford Convention with it which doomed the Federalist Party. Of course, this hardly lends to a Federalist comeback in American politics - the party's elitism unappealing to most outside New England - but it definitely prolongs their demise. Bear in mind, though, that this is all dependent on whether or not the party agrees to accept Hamilton as their standard-bearer once again after his efforts to sabotage Adams' reelection.

Another interesting tangent to would be Hamilton, having effectively retired from politics, pursuing a more philanpthropic route and continuing his work as President of the New York Manumission Society. Being the excellent organizer and orator he was, Hamilton could prove very influential in the promotion of manumission on a national level and actively work with Federalist allies in Maryland and Delaware to end slavery in segments of the upper south, including the nation's capital.
 
Others in this thread have disposed of the red herring that Hamilton was ineligible to be President because he was born on St.Croix. This seems to come up whenerver the words "Hamilton" and "President" are used in the same sentence and the answer is always the same "read the Constitution".
I would like to deal with the charge that AH was a "power hungry imperialist" as portrayed in the John Adams miniseries. First of all, John Adams hated Hamilton. To Adams, Hamilton was the "bastard brat of a Scotch peddler". Literally true, but still still hitting Hamilton below the belt and ignoring the fact that Hamilton had overcome the stigma of his birth, his abject poverty and his "foreigness" to become a brave soldier, a leading lawyer and perhaps the best political economist of his time. Second of all, the HBO miniseries was based on McCullough's biography of Adams. A great read and a fine book, but McCullough had clearly fallen in love with his subject and could find no flaw in his character or his actions and no good in any one who opposed his hero. Finally, while the HBO miniseries was great TV, it was only OK history. It compressed events, omitted key events and personalities and distorted every character from Washington to Adams' children What it did to AH was the worst, presenting him as nothing more than a loony militarist, the Iago of the Washington Administration. As soon as it was announced that Rufus Sewell would play AH I knew that no good would come of it.
I would suggest to the members of this forum who wish to know more about the real AH and his contributions to the founding of the Republic that they read Ron Chernow's recent biography of him. It portrays him, accurately I believe, as an ambitious striver, touchy about his honor and truly interested in what he thought was the best for his adopted country. Clearly not right all the time, obviously impetuous in both politics and his personal life but an amazingly clear thinker when it came to the course America should take as a capitalist society based on merit, without slavery and with a powerful central government to advance the national interest.
And no, I do not think that AH could ever have become President. Even if the Maria Reynolds scandal had not come out before he tried to run, it would come out during any election because both Jefferson and Monroe knew about it and would not hesitate to use it against Hamilton. Whenever it did come out Hamilton's response would probalby be the same as it was in OTL. "I was not paying bribes, I was being blackmailed because of my extramaritial affair. My official actions are pure, my personal life is not". The only way I can see AH getting even close to the Presidency is if the Maria Reynolds affair never happens and what is the chance of that considering AH's normal proclivities (at least at that age). Even if AH could keep out of sexual trouble, his nature was to never keep a thought unspoke (or unwritten) and that did, and would, cause him untold political trouble.
So endeth the rant.
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