Air and Space Photos from Alternate Worlds.
- Thread starter Wingman1
- Start date
Cross-post from Right Side Up.
NASA's first two Lunar Transfer Vehicles, LTV-1 and LTV-2 (affectionately known as Siegfried and Roy), make a docked burn during their first test flight. By using in-flight refueling and aerobraking, the LTV system is a fully reusable method of boosting payloads to the Moon.
After several years in space boosting cargo to the Moon, a Lunar Transfer Vehicle is picked up by a space shuttle orbiter for return to Earth for refit.
Lastly, here's some video from an early aerobraking test (click to play):
NASA's first two Lunar Transfer Vehicles, LTV-1 and LTV-2 (affectionately known as Siegfried and Roy), make a docked burn during their first test flight. By using in-flight refueling and aerobraking, the LTV system is a fully reusable method of boosting payloads to the Moon.
After several years in space boosting cargo to the Moon, a Lunar Transfer Vehicle is picked up by a space shuttle orbiter for return to Earth for refit.
Lastly, here's some video from an early aerobraking test (click to play):
Hapsburg
Banned
Interior cutaway depiction of the SV Blue Heaven, a space vehicle owned by captain Scarlett Valhalla, who uses it as a transport and tug for her mercenary and salvage operations. Coming into her ownership through dubious circumstances, the Heaven is a strange, spindly vessel that is very archaic-looking to those of the 33rd century. In an age of sleek, well-integrated spacecraft designs, the decidedly more fragile Heaven is an oddity.
The main body of the craft rotates to provide a low, but measurable gravity. The sections are divided into the CIC and Captain's Cabin section; the docking ring and main airlocks section; the medical bay and workshops section; and then the storage, quarters, mess hall, and recreation rooms section. Aft of these is the service module, containing water, purification systems, pumps, and other components, and then the auxiliary airlocks for maintenance access. Aft of the rotation elements are the low- and high-gain communications antennae, followed by the thruster-vectoring fusion torches, then the propellant bundle. At the very aft is the nuclear powerplant and the rear-facing sensor array.
The main body of the craft rotates to provide a low, but measurable gravity. The sections are divided into the CIC and Captain's Cabin section; the docking ring and main airlocks section; the medical bay and workshops section; and then the storage, quarters, mess hall, and recreation rooms section. Aft of these is the service module, containing water, purification systems, pumps, and other components, and then the auxiliary airlocks for maintenance access. Aft of the rotation elements are the low- and high-gain communications antennae, followed by the thruster-vectoring fusion torches, then the propellant bundle. At the very aft is the nuclear powerplant and the rear-facing sensor array.
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"Apollo-N, Apollo-N this is Houston broadcasting in the blind. Request Omni Bravo if you read us. Request Omni Bravo. Houston out."
As the ill fated Apollo-N CSM tumbles away from the crippled MS-N booster stage one of the crew snapped this ominous photograph. Invisibly, the nuclear rocket was dousing the three astronauts in lethal radiation - exposure which would prove fatal to them all.
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With the disastrous end of the NERVA programme and the adoption of an all-chemical approach to the Mars landing, Rockwell International's proposed Interplanetary Injection Engine became essential. The MS-II had enhanced thermal protection and insulation, 4 advanced J-2S engines and would do much of the heavy lifting on the long journey to Mars, responsible for Trans Mars Injection, Mars Orbit Insertion and Trans Earth Injection before it was jettisoned into a permanent solar orbit.
Here, MS-II-101, the first flight article, is being stacked on top of a half sister - S-II, ahead of flight testing in the KSC Vehicle Assembly Building. During launch, the booster would be topped with a nose cone similar to that on Skylab.
This might be off-topic, but has anyone heard of the Aurora Mars mission from the CDF Study Report Human Missions To Mars?
It seems like a very simple craft, with all-chemical propulsion being used, and only one cryogenic stage (that being the trans-mars injection stage). The other stages use storable chemical fuel. Existing rocket engines are also used (Vulcain 2, RD-0212 , AESTUS, YUZHNOYE RD 861-G). This simpler mars mission may be more reliable than other mars mission, due to proven technology being used. Thoughts?
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It seems like a very simple craft, with all-chemical propulsion being used, and only one cryogenic stage (that being the trans-mars injection stage). The other stages use storable chemical fuel. Existing rocket engines are also used (Vulcain 2, RD-0212 , AESTUS, YUZHNOYE RD 861-G). This simpler mars mission may be more reliable than other mars mission, due to proven technology being used. Thoughts?
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The full report (400+ pages) can be found here: http://emits.sso.esa.int/emits-doc/1-5200-RD20-HMM_Technical_Report_Final_Version.pdf
From a quick skim, one thing to note is they assume an Isp of 345s for the storable stages, stating "Note that actual storable technology for such thrust levels provide an Isp of 325 s. Here an optimistic approach has been taken."
They also assume use of Energia for most of the launches (21 out of a total of 25 over a minimum period of 4.6 years). This is a report written in 2004, whilst Energia last flew in 1988 after a grand total of 2 launches, but they make the assumption that "the effort to make it operational is smaller than the one to develop a launcher of such performances or even higher from scratch." If SLS is any guide, it is questionable how much saving re-use of existing designs gives you, and at least with SLS all the main shuttle components were still in production, which hasn't been the case for the Energia core for a couple of decades. The costs to re-start the production plant and recreate the launch infrastructure for Energia would be insanely high, and it's not a promising indication that the Russians can't even get their act together to finish Vostochny for Soyuz.
The study goes on to state that smaller launchers could be used, so to launch the necessary 1355 tonnes of hardware and propellant they would need about 68 Ariane V launches based on the 20t payload assumption in the document. That's assuming every launch is practically at capacity, which would not be the case, so probably 80 launches would be closer to reality, meaning a launch cost in the region of $15B (Wiki puts an Ariane V launch at $165–220M). Since its first launch in 1996, Ariane V has made 94 launches, with 4 failures. So this mission alone would need to almost double the number of launches. The maximum Ariane V launch rate has been 7 per year, so you're looking at over a decade to launch the mission to LEO, even assume Ariane V is used for nothing but Mars mission launches in that period, and that no replacement rocket for commercial spacecraft needs to use the Kourou launch facilities at the same time. Of course, you could just build an entire parallel launch infrastructure dedicated to this mission ("The first rule of government spending: why have one when you could have two at twice the price?"), but that would push an already unaffordable mission into the realms of total financial fantasy.
Of course things have moved on since 2004. Shift that 1355t of mass to LEO onto Falcon Heavy and you could do it in about 25-30 launches, coming in at under $3B launch costs and possibly still fit within the 4.6 year timeframe. Or, if you hate yourself, use 15 SLS Block 1B launches and pay 5x as much over a decade and a half. BFR/BFS of course would do even better (if it flies as promised), but given that's designed to do a full Mars mission anyway, using it to launch components of a less capable mission would be kind of pointless.
Still, I think the number of launches are the biggest problem for this mission, along with the complexity of integrating in LEO. These are problems going back to von Braun's very first Mars mission, and indeed this ESA study seems to take pretty much the same approach: Work out what you want to deliver back at Earth (the crew plus some samples in some kind of return capsule), work out all of the major manoeuvres needed to acomplish that, then add chemical rocket stages for each manoeuvre. The ESA study is even using pretty much the same propellants as von Braun proposed in the 1940s (except for the cryogenic departure stage). It produces a credible design using achievable technology, but it's not an elegant solution, and financially and programmatically has many issues.
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Recovery of the crew by the USS Perry. Two dead on arrival and one would suffer for a few more days.
EDIT:It is hard to see on this image, because I had to reduce it so much to post it here, but there are three crewmen in NBC suits I added on the Perry pulling the capsule in. And the frogmen are in special suits as well. This was fun to make because, obviously, the Perry was a 1980's era ship and I had to find a good Apollo recovery image to match the best photo of the Perry.
EDIT:It is hard to see on this image, because I had to reduce it so much to post it here, but there are three crewmen in NBC suits I added on the Perry pulling the capsule in. And the frogmen are in special suits as well. This was fun to make because, obviously, the Perry was a 1980's era ship and I had to find a good Apollo recovery image to match the best photo of the Perry.
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Hapsburg
Banned
Revised version of top-down and side-view, Ship Bucket scale, combat aircraft of the Central Galactic Air Force. All are capable of manned or unmanned flight, and all are powered by nuclear engines.
Aircraft design has undergone wave after wave of recurring trends. Stealth technology came and went multiple times as more powerful sensor technology was developed, surpassed, and redeveloped. The trend in the Late Terran Empire was for robust and deliberately retro-styled tailless, blended-wing or delta-wing designs. The post-Imperial period saw a resurgence in sleeker designs, v-tail control surfaces, and the resumption of radar-reducing design features, such as internal weapon bays; this was in part due to combat experience in the Great War, in which Terran aircraft were often outpaced or outgunned by enemy interceptors. Fighters were used as missile or gun platforms synchronized to remote air-defense and command-control centers. The extensive use of electronic warfare and surface-to-air missiles by enemy forces rendered these aircraft difficult to coordinate and utilize effectively, and led to tremendous losses. As such, the postwar defense establishment pushed for sleeker, faster designs, more effective armament, and more nimble controls, as well as training programs for traditional dogfighting techniques.
The F/A-178 Tigershark was among the first combat aircraft to come out of this new design philosophy, though its design shared many features with Late Imperial aircraft, such as a blended wing body. The F-122 Mako interceptor and the later F-1 Leopard Shark strike fighter are more fully-realized examples.
Aircraft design has undergone wave after wave of recurring trends. Stealth technology came and went multiple times as more powerful sensor technology was developed, surpassed, and redeveloped. The trend in the Late Terran Empire was for robust and deliberately retro-styled tailless, blended-wing or delta-wing designs. The post-Imperial period saw a resurgence in sleeker designs, v-tail control surfaces, and the resumption of radar-reducing design features, such as internal weapon bays; this was in part due to combat experience in the Great War, in which Terran aircraft were often outpaced or outgunned by enemy interceptors. Fighters were used as missile or gun platforms synchronized to remote air-defense and command-control centers. The extensive use of electronic warfare and surface-to-air missiles by enemy forces rendered these aircraft difficult to coordinate and utilize effectively, and led to tremendous losses. As such, the postwar defense establishment pushed for sleeker, faster designs, more effective armament, and more nimble controls, as well as training programs for traditional dogfighting techniques.
The F/A-178 Tigershark was among the first combat aircraft to come out of this new design philosophy, though its design shared many features with Late Imperial aircraft, such as a blended wing body. The F-122 Mako interceptor and the later F-1 Leopard Shark strike fighter are more fully-realized examples.
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In what way if you don't mind me asking? It it similar to Project Pluto's propulsion?
I think I did a roll out image of this, I will need to check!
EDIT: Actually it was a tanker rollout, but the same configuration.
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Hapsburg
Banned
Oh no, nothing so dangerous as that. I mean, it broadly uses the principle of a nuclear reactor to superheat air from the intake, expelling it as hot exhaust. But Pluto's exact design is very dangerous, expelling irradiated gas in its exhaust, and using an unshielded reactor to basically poison areas it traveled over. Effective for a WMD, but piss-poor for a combat aircraft. And even the early ANP proposals for nuclear-powered aircraft in the 1950s, which were open-cycle like the SLAM/Pluto weapon, had their potential issues with radiation and were probably unforeseen at the time. A better method that was developed in the mid-late 1950s for the same program used an indirect cycle, where the reactor heats a liquid which is then used to heat incoming air through a system of heat exchangers.
In my setting, advances in materials science and electronics over the next thousand years allows the ubiquitous use of miniaturized nuclear reactors. Making this not only a reality, but a safe and reliable one.
Great! I assume they can stay flying for weeks at a time without landing? If so, range becomes a non-issue and they can patrol a airspace for days.
Hapsburg
Banned
In theory, yes. It's still a good idea for them to limit flight time. People have to rest, aircraft have to be maintained. You don't want to overwork a sensitive piece of machinery, let alone a flying nuclear reactor.
And while an aircraft might plausibly have unlimited range, if something catastrophic happens to a nuclear-powered patrol jet or what-have-you, you want to craft to remain within easy, quick reach. Sure, another nuclear-powered jet will get there because it also has unlimited range. But will it get there in time? Time can very much be of the essence for an injured pilot, or a leaking reactor, or any other number of problems that might arise.
Okay so i found this image of quite the take on the Shuttle II/Evolved shuttle concept here and i'm just dying to see the other two pictures the post mentions, however those are apparently only available to patreon members and i cant seem to find information on this anywhere else on internet land after a solid hour and a half of searching?
