AHC/WI: Austria included in German-Reunification '90

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Simple:

Get Austria to be included in the re-unification process after the fall of the Berlin Wall.

Pod can be anytime after '45

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What are the long term economic, social, diplomatic implications? (EU, France, NATO)

Would it be better for Europe, had this occuried?
 
Austrian far-right politician Jörg Haider was into this. But I can't see a scenario in which yet another Austrian with a name starting with "H" and ending with "er" is likely to become German chancellor in the past 20 years...
 
Perhaps a permanent Soviet presence in Austria to make them more like the DDR and more willing to join the FDR.

The only way I can see it happening is if in 1945 the Allies decide that Austria is naturally part of Germany and therefore keep Germany at its post Anschlauss borders (less the Sudetenland and the territories ceded to Poland).

Therefore as you suggest the WAllied zones of Austria become part of the BRD the Soviet Zone of Austria joins the DDR when these states are set up.

Vienna is still divided between the 4 powers, so there would be a Vienna blockade to match the Berlin blockade of the late 1940s and a Vienna Wall to match the Berlin Wall.
 
The only way I can see it happening is if in 1945 the Allies decide that Austria is naturally part of Germany and therefore keep Germany at its post Anschlauss borders (less the Sudetenland and the territories ceded to Poland).

Therefore as you suggest the WAllied zones of Austria become part of the BRD the Soviet Zone of Austria joins the DDR when these states are set up.

Vienna is still divided between the 4 powers, so there would be a Vienna blockade to match the Berlin blockade of the late 1940s and a Vienna Wall to match the Berlin Wall.

Sounds workable, then have the Soviets clamp down more violently than OTL on dissent in WPO countries and there may be more of a sense of German solidarity as West Germans and West Austrians feel enraged at what is happening to their countrymen.
 

Nebogipfel

Monthly Donor
The problem here is that the vast majority of germans and austrians actually rejects any Anschluss. And that majority is increasing, steadily.

Post-war Austria saw itself as first victim of Nazi-Germany, and tried to distance itself as much as possible from its neighbour.

Nowadays, Germany and Austria are as different as Germany and the Netherlands. Some similarity regarding the language and culture, but thats it.
 
The problem here is that the vast majority of germans and austrians actually rejects any Anschluss. And that majority is increasing, steadily.

Post-war Austria saw itself as first victim of Nazi-Germany, and tried to distance itself as much as possible from its neighbour.

Nowadays, Germany and Austria are as different as Germany and the Netherlands. Some similarity regarding the language and culture, but thats it.

Uhm, what? The only real difference between Austrians and Germans is that Austrians tend to be far more conservative.
 

Deleted member 1487

Leaving aside the huge political difficulty of making this happen, what would the combined Austro-German economic situation be if it did and what would their clout be in the post-Communist Europe? Would the extra money from Austria make the East German situation any better? Would the savings from combining militaries and government functions be appreciable?
 
Leaving aside the huge political difficulty of making this happen, what would the combined Austro-German economic situation be if it did and what would their clout be in the post-Communist Europe? Would the extra money from Austria make the East German situation any better? Would the savings from combining militaries and government functions be appreciable?

Bump.

You always have good follow up questions wiking
 
The Moscow State Treaty, which ended the occupation of Austria and made it an independent country in 1955 forbade Austria becoming a part of Germany and made Austria a neutral country.
In fact, the prohibition on Austria to enter any sort of union with Germany is why they didn't join the EU until 1995, after the Berlin Wall fell. They actually had wanted to join for decades, ever since the EEC was set up, according to Nanwe (who knows quite a lot of EU history), but they didn't because they didn't know whether joining the EU would be seen as a second Anschluss by the Soviets.
That's why they ended up joining EFTA...

So in order to allow for Austria to be included, you have to have the occupation go differently (don't have Moscow State Treaty, at least) and not have the whole "first victim of the Nazis" thing, which played a significant role in establishing a distinct Austrian identity...

Nowadays, Austrians are to Germans what Canadians are to Americans-similar in culture, speak the same language, but consider themselves as distinct peoples and don't want to become part of the other country...
 
The only way I can see it happening is if in 1945 the Allies decide that Austria is naturally part of Germany and therefore keep Germany at its post Anschlauss borders (less the Sudetenland and the territories ceded to Poland).

Therefore as you suggest the WAllied zones of Austria become part of the BRD the Soviet Zone of Austria joins the DDR when these states are set up.

Vienna is still divided between the 4 powers, so there would be a Vienna blockade to match the Berlin blockade of the late 1940s and a Vienna Wall to match the Berlin Wall.

Ditto - Austria was considered as a nation to be a victim of German aggression, so by viewing it as an integral part of it and making the populace believe this, you could facilitate reunification.
 
Ditto - Austria was considered as a nation to be a victim of German aggression, so by viewing it as an integral part of it and making the populace believe this, you could facilitate reunification.

By whom was Austria seen as a victim of German aggression? This myth never fails to raise my hackles. An overwhelming majority of Austrians was in favor of Anschluss and many Austrians - a disproportionate number of them, btw - were to be found in the higher echelons of the Third Reich's leadership and the perpetrators of atrocities.

By painting themselves as the first victims of Nazism, they effectively prevented any meaningful discussion on their role in WW2, resulting in a casual xenophobia lasting until today that is absolutely stunning.
 
I think the best possibility is, if the 4 Power fail to reach a aggrement about Austria and the country gets devided like Germany. East Austria with Vienna becomes a communist state. For West Austria the Western Allies (speak the USA) decide that its economical to weak to exist seperatly and let it join West Germany. A side effect is, that the NATO will have a frontline going from the Baltic Sea till the Adria.
 
By whom was Austria seen as a victim of German aggression? This myth never fails to raise my hackles. An overwhelming majority of Austrians was in favor of Anschluss and many Austrians - a disproportionate number of them, btw - were to be found in the higher echelons of the Third Reich's leadership and the perpetrators of atrocities.

By painting themselves as the first victims of Nazism, they effectively prevented any meaningful discussion on their role in WW2, resulting in a casual xenophobia lasting until today that is absolutely stunning.

By almost everyone post-War. Was it true? No. Was it a very useful whitewashing? Useful for both the Austrians and both the West and the Soviets? Yes, it was. With no one (audibly) protesting the rewriting of history, it got to stand quite long enough to serve the political purposes it was invented for.

I'd say it stood pretty much unchallenged until Kurt Waldheim's history came out, which opened that whole can of worms.

Do note that the phrase was "seen as a victim", not "was a victim".
 
By whom was Austria seen as a victim of German aggression? This myth never fails to raise my hackles. An overwhelming majority of Austrians was in favor of Anschluss and many Austrians - a disproportionate number of them, btw - were to be found in the higher echelons of the Third Reich's leadership and the perpetrators of atrocities.

By painting themselves as the first victims of Nazism, they effectively prevented any meaningful discussion on their role in WW2, resulting in a casual xenophobia lasting until today that is absolutely stunning.

They are saying that America believed Austria was the first victim of German aggression and that is why they got off so easy and they are right. Obviously, the Austrians were more then happy to play into that concept that they were no different then the Poles.

Americans also believed that the Prussians were basically the puppeteers of the Nazis and the real power running the show in Nazi Germany. You can see it in the popular media even ten years after the war that the Prussians ran the Nazi Party and in effect used Hitler as a evil useful idiot to start another world war and purge Europe of Jews.

It's why the U.S. gave Stalin the thumbs up to end Prussia permanently.

Huge misperceptions by America in WW2 had a significant impact on the post war world as they effected the policies of the run up to the end of the war and in the immediate post war years.
 
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