AHC/WI: A Second Ostsiedlung

CaliGuy

Banned
What realistic way is there to create a second Ostsiedlung?

Also, for the record, what I am thinking of here is a large-scale ethnic German migration into the East which is clearly visible on a map like the original Ostsiedlung was; thus, the ethnic German migrations into Russia in the late 18th and 19th centuries certainly don't work for this. Plus, what I want is a second Ostsiedlung without the genocide of the Nazi era.

Anyway, any thoughts on this? Also, for the record, while there is no time limit for this AHC, you get bonus points if you can make the second Ostsiedlung come earlier rather than later.

Finally, for reference: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostsiedlung
 

CaliGuy

Banned
Would having the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth allow large-scale ethnic German immigration work for this? Indeed, would that be realistic?
 
Actually,i have a better idea.
What if,the teutonic order is able to get the better of poland-lithuania at grunwald,winning the polish-teutonic-lithuanian war,and flourishes,bringing in many settlers from the HRE. That way,you'll have alot more germans in prussia/pomerania/livonia,perhaps some in lithuania?
 

CaliGuy

Banned
Actually,i have a better idea.
What if,the teutonic order is able to get the better of poland-lithuania at grunwald,winning the polish-teutonic-lithuanian war,and flourishes,bringing in many settlers from the HRE. That way,you'll have alot more germans in prussia/pomerania/livonia,perhaps some in lithuania?
Would a defeat at Grunwald have been that crippling for Poland-Lithuania, though?
 
No,it would not be,but it would weaken them some,and more importantly, give the to breathing room. Also,by Lithuania, I meant samogitia. Should've clarified that.
 
Actually,i have a better idea.
What if,the teutonic order is able to get the better of poland-lithuania at grunwald,winning the polish-teutonic-lithuanian war,and flourishes,bringing in many settlers from the HRE. That way,you'll have alot more germans in prussia/pomerania/livonia,perhaps some in lithuania?
If Poland and Lithuania lose in Grunwald, they will just win a few years later.

The Teutonic Order was not going to survive for long with Poland and Lithuania as a team, not as a monastic order anyway.

No,it would not be,but it would weaken them some,and more importantly, give the to breathing room. Also,by Lithuania, I meant samogitia. Should've clarified that.
Samogitia was not controlled by the Teutonic Order during the War of 1410, and they would lack the strength to reconquer it, even if they win Grunwald.
 
a few years is is still time for more german settlers to come,and for the order to make new friends. Stranger things have happened.
 
The single biggest Germany-screw is the 30YW, so i"d say prevent that.

That is important to ensure you've actually got enough people who want to come. The other side is politics. THe way I see it, you either have to weaken Germany or Poland/Lithuania. If Germany is (remains) weak enough not to constitute a political problem for the Polish kings, there is no reason they would object to Germans enruiching them by populating empty lands bringing valuable skills. If Poland is so weak it cannot object, the settlers can just come.

One possibility would be a crushing Vasa victory in Poland after a quick Habsburg victory in what will be known as the War of the Bohemian Succession. The Swedish conquest will alienate many Poles, so the new king, intent on destroying Polish checks and balances, decides to import a supportive population of German Protestats. The Habsburgs oblige him by expelling large numbers of Protestants from Germany's most populous regions.
 

CaliGuy

Banned
One possibility would be a crushing Vasa victory in Poland after a quick Habsburg victory in what will be known as the War of the Bohemian Succession. The Swedish conquest will alienate many Poles, so the new king, intent on destroying Polish checks and balances, decides to import a supportive population of German Protestats. The Habsburgs oblige him by expelling large numbers of Protestants from Germany's most populous regions.
Very interesting! :) Indeed, can you please elaborate on this? :)
 
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