AHC/WI: A More Widespread Protestant Reformation?

CaliGuy

Banned
Converting all of France to Protestantism is challenging (though, if the Concordat of Bologna does not happen, could be possible). But I could also envision a timeline in which the Valois dynasty has surviving sons, and so Henri de Navarre and the Huguenots abandon the goal of conquering Paris and focus instead on forming a breakaway Protestant kingdom in the south.
Would such a Protestant state have been viable over the long-run, though? Indeed, wasn't northern France more populous than southern France?
 
@Beausoleil You are right on most counts and I freely admit that my knowledge of theology is a bit sketchy and I was not being precise in my earlier comment.

I didn't mean to say that it would be easy or possible for Catholicism and Lutheranism to find some sort of common ground, my point is that it could be possible (although unlikely, I admit it) to have a less radical reform movement develop inside the Church which could take at least some of the steam away from otl's Protestantism. About sacraments, while they were at this point rather well established already, I was under the assumption that their number and precise meaning were only codified canonically at the Council of Trento, but I might be wrong.

I think that different interpretations could still be given to some sacraments, especially marriage, confirmation and penitence (I mean earlier and stricter rules about indulgences).

But probably that would not qualify as a "reformed" Church in the sense that the OP wanted, so I am afraid I am getting a bit off topic.

Realistically, you could see Bohemia, Hungary, Poland, the Baltics and more of the Netherlands swing to the Protestants, as well as more german states, while I don't see Protestants becoming the majority in France (but if the edict of Nantes is not revoked they could stay as a sizeable minority to the present day).
 
Would such a Protestant state have been viable over the long-run, though? Indeed, wasn't northern France more populous than southern France?

The north was indeed more populous than the south. There is also Spain on the other side of the Pyrenees, so it would face difficulties, but we've seen other nations overcome long odds.

It would probably only include part of the pink/purple areas on this map:
1011270-Les_guerres_de_Religion_1578-1598.jpg

Those northern enclaves most likely would be lost, and probably the areas in the southeast but perhaps a more compact state could be formed with its northern border on a line from La Rochelle to Argenton, and then including most/all of the southwest.
 
Poland convering to Protestantism also is not that likely-king is not in position to enforce reformation and it is simply impossible that every noble would just convert willingly, and Poland didn't have Cuius regio eius religio rule, even protestant nobles didn't bother to convert their peasants. When counter-reformation started Polish Protestantism quickly dimished.
 
Would Catholicism even survive in such a case?

It could actually lead to less success for the Protestant cause across the board. Imagine almost all of the German states that don't like the Habsburgs allying closely with France and Spain. What would probably happen is an earlier abolition of the HRE or else the King of France becoming elected to be its head regularly. It would make things even bloodier than OTL, but a Protestant Archduke of Austria would be a gift to the war hawks in France.
 

CaliGuy

Banned
The north was indeed more populous than the south. There is also Spain on the other side of the Pyrenees, so it would face difficulties, but we've seen other nations overcome long odds.

It would probably only include part of the pink/purple areas on this map:
1011270-Les_guerres_de_Religion_1578-1598.jpg

Those northern enclaves most likely would be lost, and probably the areas in the southeast but perhaps a more compact state could be formed with its northern border on a line from La Rochelle to Argenton, and then including most/all of the southwest.
So, in other words, it would become an independent mega-Aquitaine?
 
I've always kind of wondered what things would look like if the Bohemian phase of the 30 Years War had gone much better for the Protestants. Pretty much all of the Austrian Habsburgs' lands were in revolt, and the Habsburgs had to rely on Catholic princes (along with a few opportunistic Protestants like the Elector of Saxony) and the Spanish to bail them out. It would only really expand things into Austria/Hungary/Bohemia, and maybe the Spanish Netherlands and some of the German Catholic states (assuming they were overrun by Protestant states ITTL instead of the other way around).
 
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