AHC: War Plan Gold

War Plan Gold was one of the US colour-coded plans. WPG called for a potential naval war with France.

According to Avalanche Press:

"The United States had stood alongside its 'oldest ally' during the First World War, but in the years immediately afterwards the Navy looked at the potential for radical politicians to change France from friend to foe. Also, the peace negotiations which followed the war revealed deep underlying tensions between the Americans and their European allies; some of the more paranoid came to believe the next war would be between Europe and America."

You need to create a timeline where the US is forced to activate War Plan Gold. No ASBs.
 
Was there some fascist dipshit who could have taken over France a la Franco or Mussolini and been belligerent to the U.K. and US? Let’s start with that, at least as part of a War Plan Rainbow.
 
Was there some fascist dipshit who could have taken over France a la Franco or Mussolini and been belligerent to the U.K. and US? Let’s start with that, at least as part of a War Plan Rainbow.
Always thought that is an interesting concept, one of my favourite TL's https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/tiger-tiger-burning-bright.262049/ was based of a fascist France, being a sequel to https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/the-franco-japanese-war.230861/ has a fascist France, having basically taken the place of Germany in ww1 too
France would almost certainly try and stick to merchant raiding rather than a full confrontation with the US navy, the likes of the Dunkerques and the big french cruisers would've been good surface raiders.
 
Was there some fascist dipshit who could have taken over France a la Franco or Mussolini and been belligerent to the U.K. and US?
Pierre Laval was a Mussolini Mini-Me, started off a Socialist and into eventually Fascism. Even got to be 'Man of the Year'.
Wouldn't be too hard to tweak a Paris-Rome Axis, after Laval works a Coup on the Communist leaning Popular Front in 1936/37, and assists Franco.

Note that this Axis is not friendly to the Mustache over in Germany, and Italy chases out the Nazis from Austria in 1938, as French forces move back into the Saar, that was mostly unopposed.
The Wehrmacht forces are forced to retreat back to Germany proper, and Austrian Nazis are put into camps.

This Axis would be belligerent towards the UK, but it's really hard against the USA
 

Driftless

Donor
France would almost certainly try and stick to merchant raiding rather than a full confrontation with the US navy, the likes of the Dunkerques and the big french cruisers would've been good surface raiders.

Several of the French cruisers had 7500mi/12,000km+/- range, which would be useful, but several more were short-ranged, as their primary operational area was the Med. The Dunkerque & Strasbourg would have required either the OTL South Dakota's or even CalBear's beloved Alaska's to have both sufficient speed and firepower. The Algerie would have made a great raider

Another alternative point to consider with the ships cruising ranges: the French had colonies with good ports across the globe, so if the British are not in the fight, the USN would have a more difficult time catching the raiders. By comparison, think of the challenges the British had chasing down German raiders. The British had worldwide bases and plenty of ships, and the Germans had neither.
 
the UK was firing real bullets (and shells) in 1940? while the Vichy regime might have had some grudging respect for British actions, what if things worsen?

Dunkirk evacuation stopped earlier, before any French troops depart. the battleship Strasbourg sunk fleeing, the RN was firing on it. (or some other combination of events)

a commerce (or vengeance) war against UK, with the French joining in, or otherwise facilitating, would have been (especially in 1940) a level of magnitude more effective? thus more likely to drag US in?
 
One of the problems with naval raiders vs the US is that in the 20th Century so much trade into US ports was in non US flagged ships. Norwegian, Greek, Dutch, British, ect... ect... A big part of this is US based shipowners have found it useful to flag their ships in other nations, Panama has been popular. To seriously disrupt cargo shipping of US goods neutral flagged ship carrying those goods would have to be identified and attacked.

Always thought that is an interesting concept, one of my favourite TL's https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/tiger-tiger-burning-bright.262049/ was based of a fascist France, being a sequel to https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/the-franco-japanese-war.230861/ has a fascist France, having basically taken the place of Germany in ww1 too
France would almost certainly try and stick to merchant raiding rather than a full confrontation with the US navy, the likes of the Dunkerques and the big french cruisers would've been good surface raiders.

I was thinking the opposite. The Communists take control & get crossways with the US concerning war debt, colonial affairs in Latin America, and arguments about which cheese to serve with the wine.

Unless we waive away the Washington Naval Treaty its the USN 'Standards' vs whatever the French have at the moment. I suspect a Communist France may not have the same naval construction program of OTL. If the WNT is absent then We'd see the original South Dakota class from the latter 1920s replacing the older Standards. Whatever else happens we'd see US aircraft carriers. Conversely the Bearn might be waived away.
 
I have four ideas of post WWII scenarios where this may happen:

1. France goes communist sometime between the liberation of Paris and the beginning of the cold war.

2. Something happens to de Gaulle before or during his presidency and the coup leaders trigger a NATO intervention or something similar, possibly due to worry over France's nuclear capabilities.

3. The rioting in the late sixties turns into a revolution and the government is overthrown, and similar to the above post, NATO intervenes to secure nukes and prevent France from becoming a Soviet friendly state.

4. French military actions or nuclear testing results in American casualties in a politically undeniable fashion.

I'm unsure of the probability of all these, however with the domino theory in effect and the ever present fear of nukes falling into the wrong hands, I would think the possibility of a peacekeeping operation or a desert storm type mission possible.
 
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