AHC: The Jurchens or Khitai carve out a vast Empire, not the Mongols

How can one make the Jurchens (Early Manchus) or Khitai carve out an Empire much like the OTL Mongol Empire?
 

katchen

Banned
The Jurchens get into a conflict with the Mongols or the Khitai, with the Eastern Turks and conquer Mongolia first, then start moving west, including conquering Hsi Hsia and Kara Khitai and Tibet before taking on Song China. The Jurchen realize that they need to unify all of the steppe peoples (and the Siberian forest too, if possible, or they will not have the numbers to conquer China. If the Jurched arrive in Europe in the 8th Century having built the kind of institutions that will hold an empire together, they stand an excellent chance of conquering most or all of continental Europe since the nations of Europe have not completely gelled yet. After unifying the steppe and Europe, the Jurched may be able to take on China and conquer the Song completely. And hopefully, they do not have the problem with alcohol that the Mongols appear to have. IOTL.
 
If we're talking about the Jurcbens, Europe doesn't have to worry about them in the 8th C.
There were no people identified as Jurchen at that early date.

Both the Jurchen and the Kara Kitai formed formidable polities. Give them a leader as charismatic as Genghis, with his military and organizational genius, and maybe they could likewise create their own space-filling empires.;)

More adept diplomacy and better fortune might have prevented the Jurchen Jin Dynasty from getting caught up in a fatal 2 front war with both the Mongols and the Song. If not weakened by this, they might have a better chance in fending off or defeating the Mongols. Of course, by this time they were so Sinocized that they are no longer a Steppe people and were more insular as any Han dynasty tended to be.

As the Manchu, the Jurchen got a second opportunity to create a long-term relatively stable China centered Empire.
 
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