AHC: Surviving New World Monarchies

Flubber

Banned
How about religious fervor? That's always a good one. Perhaps the Wars of Religion are much more widespread, while deepening a reliance on faith and a rejection of secular sciences and non-orthodox thought.


But those people employing secular sciences and non-orthodox thought are getting rich and, as Cicero pointed out, wealth translates directly into power.

If new lands are discovered, it's the will of God.

Those new lands were discovered in the 15th Century because of the explosion in secular science and non-orthodox thought.

Alternately, would an epidemic be too ASB?

A reverse Columbian Exchange or one that goes both ways? That will depend on what diseases the New World can produce and we all know that will depend heavily on how many domesticates the New World contains.

Then again, if a plague or plagues ravage Europe to the extent you're considering, why is there even an European style kingdom founded in the New World?
 
But those people employing secular sciences and non-orthodox thought are getting rich and, as Cicero pointed out, wealth translates directly into power.



Those new lands were discovered in the 15th Century because of the explosion in secular science and non-orthodox thought.



A reverse Columbian Exchange or one that goes both ways? That will depend on what diseases the New World can produce and we all know that will depend heavily on how many domesticates the New World contains.

Then again, if a plague or plagues ravage Europe to the extent you're considering, why is there even an European style kingdom founded in the New World?

Nah, I wasn't thinking that ASB, I was thinking just a regular Eurasian epidemic strong enough to delay progress a century or two. This would occur before the discovery of the Americas, not at the same time. The population would have recovered by the time of the discovery, but the blow would still have delayed things intellectually. I'll admit it's tricky to get the timing right, I'm just throwing out possibilities.

Or maybe the epidemic could be of the sort that doesn't wipe out half the population, but that comes around again and again every generation or so, carrying off enough of the population to make growth very slow. After a few centuries the population would be resistant enough that it would no longer be much of a killer, and population numbers would start climbing dramatically again.
 

Flubber

Banned
I'll admit it's tricky to get the timing right, I'm just throwing out possibilities.


Understood.

A plague could possibly chase people across the Atlantic where they settle a kingdom. You've got quite a bit of "pre-Columbian" knowledge concerning the existence of lands across the ocean floating around Europe what with the Basques, English, Danes, and so forth.
 
Understood.

A plague could possibly chase people across the Atlantic where they settle a kingdom. You've got quite a bit of "pre-Columbian" knowledge concerning the existence of lands across the ocean floating around Europe what with the Basques, English, Danes, and so forth.

It's a possibility. Yikes, especially if a few boats are infected after all and spread the epidemic to the unexposed natives. This scenario would result in very isolated colonies, but if the European settler populations recover fast from the epidemic, their natural growth rate may make those colonies reasonably large.

Then again, if it's a brand new disease rather than one that's been kicking around Eurasia for millenia, the Europeans would be just as vulnerable to it as the Amerindians, meaning colonization would never get off the ground. Hmmm.
 
At the time of independence (circa 1810), Argentina was semi seriously looking for a monarch. The problem was that legitimate contenders were difficult to come by. Charles IV of Spain actively discouraged his family members from considering it. They thought about an Indian Monarchy, but nothing came of it.

I've heard that at one point late 1700's - early 1800's, Charles considered splitting up the Americas into 3 or 4 monarchies, presumably with his children as heads, and presumably in some sort of union with Spain. I know didly about the plan though.

You could finagle a way for Charles or one of his sons to escape Napoleon's clutches and move the court to the new world, ala Braganca's of Brazil.
 
I don't know why, but one of my favorite ways for a New World Monarchy is that During the Napoleonic Wars, the Spanish Government flees to Mexico City, setting up a government-in-exile there.

Getting them to stay in the long runs is a bit harder, but not impossible. Maybe have Napoleon declare a family member, or even himself King of Spain, and the Spanish Royalty feel to bad about themselves to do anything. They feel weak and that that people are laughing at them. They just never try to go back, because the whole turn of the war could go differently this way.
 
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