AHC Surviving Greco - Bactrian Kingdom

Modu did what the Manchurians did to Dzungarians to Yuezhi, aka complete genocide, leaving no one to found the Kushan Empire. While their ability to do so is uncertain, according to History of Dayuan, Shiji, Xiongnu captives told stories about Modu drinking from the head of the King of Yuezhi, so it may not be out of character for him to do so.
 
Well a good start might be to not have the Greco-Baktrians to waste resources invading into India. Or, if you want a POD that is more likely to work for a lasting period of time...don't have the Seleucid Empire crumble, yet don't have it be too terribly strong either. The idea situation for Baktria IMO is paying lip service as a vassal of the Seleucids while de facto ruling on their own-it gives them the most freedom and protection at the same time since it's in the Seleucid's best interests to not have nomads overrun Baktria.
 

GdwnsnHo

Banned
Honestly, this is probably my fav question whenever it comes up :)

The biggest requirement for this - more greeks, and ideally developing a strong city-based cavalry tradition.

Be it some king offering absurd (or rumored to be offering absurd) benefits to macedonians/greeks from outside the Selucid empire to move there (so as not to piss off their overlord) or a '9-child policy' where somehow the state subsidises greek or greco-bactrian births - you need these bodies to strengthen the state.

Perhaps a port on the Caspian (if in their territory) could be a route, especially for emigrant Pontic greeks? - may need a crushing of Parthia - but not implausible if the Selucids are more stable.

But yeah, more bodies - at least culturally greek bodies - and the adaptation to central asia, are what you'll need for any successful greco-bactrian kingdom. To even make that practical, you need to engineer their dominance over the local nomadic tribes - even if it means Greek Central Asian Cossacks.
 
This is a question that was picqued by a recent visit that showcased the impact of Hellenic civilisation to Afghanistan. My thoughts echo yours as there is a need for a stronger population base and ideally the maintenance of trade between the two. If we really want something cool POD have some of the Byzantine diaspora flee east as well as west...
 

GdwnsnHo

Banned
Byzantine diaspora


Yeah, wrong milennium methinks for the crucial PoD.

If the timelines are more deterministic than we imagined, then perhaps it would be a nice follow-up... but the distances are still huge.

My only other thought would be how they could rapidly hellenise the neighbouring lands.

Disclaimer : I dislike the following and personally find it repulsive.

Another option would be to mimic the Janissary system or go one step further, and steal children whilst killing their parents - removes present and future enemies - improves the "Greek" manpower base, whilst also reducing the total strain on resources by the humans of central asia.

*feels dirty at that suggestion*

The only problem is that I'd be scared of the response of other tribes if the greeks did this to a well-connected tribe.
 
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I think it's just easier and cheaper to just keep the Selecuids from losing ground in Persia, if only because such an issue involving creating Hellenic Janissaries is going to end particularly badly for Bactria.
 
Demetrius Aniketos is killed early on in his campaign against the Sunga, forcing his army to withdraw from making further gains in India. Euthydemus, Agathocles and Pantaleon, Demetrius' OTL successors, split the army into three factions supporting each other, leading the country into civil war. One of them pleads fealty to Seleucid king Seleucus IV to support claim to throne. Bactria returns to become a satellite state of the Seleucid Empire which is now pivots more to the east, allowing both states to survive a bit longer. Migration from mainland Greece and the more established Hellenistic cultural outspots continue, allowing Bactria to have more of a Greek imprint. \
 

GdwnsnHo

Banned
Hmm, another thought would be to just not invade India. Sunda aren't likely to try and invade Bactria - and it preserves Bactrias strength which should sufficient to resist any nomadic invasions, and prevent a civil war.

If neither event happens, we don't see the kingdom collapse.

Instead a better route would be to partition the Parthians between Bactria and the Selucids (assuming they have the strength - this I do not know).

If Bactria ensure they get a coastline, then not only do they have an ally through which greeks can immigrate, but also coastal towns that could enable safe immigration from Ptolematic Egypt, and Greece proper.

I'd expect such a partition to include Gedriosa and Aria - and grant them the Persian coastline east of the Strait of Hormuz.

So perhaps we need the King of Bactria not to be interested in the Sunda? or have Sunda lose a crucial battle and not take out the Mauryans? I remember reading somewhere that it was Sundas rise that brought the Greeks back to India.

So yeah, more tasteful than my earlier thought, but they'd still need to win at least two wars - to quell nomads, and against Parthia - all whilst keeping generals in line. Interesting times indeed.

Though Greco-Bactria would now be well placed to focus on Indian, Scythian, and Tarim/Urumqi schemes, I have to add a disclaimer that whilst it may be more hellenic (or fully hellenic) - I'd expect it to not benefit the greeks in the med - and that they'd eventually form a new Bactrian identity.
 
The problem is that one of the reasons Demetrius invaded India was to protect the Greek communities in the Maurya Empire. Many Greeks in the western part of the Maurya Empire had converted to Buddhism and the Sunga were heavy persecutors of Buddhism in the lands they already conquered in eastern India, being orthodox Hindus. You need to have Pushyamitra's coup against the Maurya fail miserably and you remove a casus belli for Demetrius' invasion.
 
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