AHC: Successfull Op. Sealion
- Thread starter Geomec
- Start date
Sandman396
Banned
Oh how quickly the usual entrenched positions are adopted.
With a POD in '33 it is possible to prepare for an invasion of the UK.
Two things need to be done above all;
1) Destroy the RN
2) Destroy the RAF
If those conditions are met then it is possible.
Neither of those conditions are impossible. They were just not done in OTL hence why SL did not and could not take place.
With a POD in '33 it is possible to prepare for an invasion of the UK.
Two things need to be done above all;
1) Destroy the RN
2) Destroy the RAF
If those conditions are met then it is possible.
Neither of those conditions are impossible. They were just not done in OTL hence why SL did not and could not take place.
That's because this dead horse has been flogged to death many times, so there isn't much need for further floggings. Things you need to know are known by everybody. Save maybe the guy opening this thread.
Since the Army would have a thing or two to say, let's add
3) Destroy the Army.
Sure. Nothing is impossible. You only have three conditions, each of them being extremely unlikely, and you only need to satisfy all three for this to work.
Can I please have some of your medication, it will cheer me up with the current lousy weather.....
I notice some posters seem to think that the magic LW planes will interdict the channel and surrounding sea areas.
I would suggest looking up the results of the LW attacking the British and allied ships evacuating Dunkirk for around a week, while in restricted waters and often stationary, then comparing it to the number of destroyers (alone) available to the RN.
Then realise it will only take the RN 2-3 days to sink the German shipping. At most.
I would suggest looking up the results of the LW attacking the British and allied ships evacuating Dunkirk for around a week, while in restricted waters and often stationary, then comparing it to the number of destroyers (alone) available to the RN.
Then realise it will only take the RN 2-3 days to sink the German shipping. At most.
Sandman396
Banned
You do not need to destroy the Army to carry out the invasion.
You need to destroy the Army to allow completion of the occupation.
As to "good weather in the Channel" this is not required if you have managed to achieve conditions 1 & 2 as once this is done you can land anywhere you want from Plymouth to Newcastle.
The UK was not this "impregnable fortress".
Yes, it was. You realise that saying 'destroy the RN and the RAF and you can do it' is like saying 'destroy the USN and USAF and you can invade the USA today'? While the statement is technically true, it's impossible to achieve with the resources of the nation in question that wants to do it. Stukas and Ju88s are not going to destroy the Royal Navy. Sorry.
Sandman396
Banned
Why does it have to be Stukas and Ju88s if the POD is 1933?
Are you saying that the Germans could not have, if they prepared for it during the years leading up to the war, actually invaded the UK?
Are you saying that the Germans could not have, if they prepared for it during the years leading up to the war, actually invaded the UK?
Yes. For the Germans (be they Nazis or otherwise) to have a navy and airforce capable of destroying the Royal Navy in September 1940, you need a PoD back in the dreadnought races of the turn of the century.
Wait, what? As long as there is a single guy with a shotgun in Britain, he will be deployed on the beach to try and stop Germans. And Brits had around million dudes with shotguns. And rifles and some cannons. Even if somehow RAF suffered big losses, they would retreat to north and replenish. At the moment of the invasion they will come back and contest German air supremacy. Plus all the destroyers, light cruisers, heavy cruisers, auxiliaries, motor and torpedo boats, coastal arty, the works.
For all intents and purposes it was. Germans were simply not in position to use the fragility of British position.
Back to the old Hitler moves his chess pieces and the world picks fluff from its navel.
Do you know why Germany picked the structure of Luftwaffe the way it did and why it was prioritized over navy? Do you realize that real countries with real economies in real life face something called opportunity cost and finite resources? Are you aware of challenges Germans face in 1933 and force structure necessary to overwhelm it? With POD in 1933 there is no way. Granted, if it was only between Germany and UK, perhaps with a very long shot something could be put together. But it is not. Germany has to defeat Poland and France. It has to put up credible force against Soviets. No freaking way to achieve all that within six years it has.
With a POD in 1914 I just can't come up with any realistic change in situation. Perhaps if say, Germans lose earlier and manage to retain their fleet and much of the country. Russia dissolves in general anarchy for some reason or another. Then a depression hits and right wing German government comes in after attempted Red revolution. They manage to get into argument with Britain and France, defeat them. Having retained and modernized their fleet, they might or might not be able to pull off Sea mammal. But to me it sounds far fetched...
Ah, so the Armys only purpose during the invasions is presumably to man the beaches so as to direct the Germasn the right way...
And I'm afraid you have NO idea of weather conditions in the channel, even in summer, if you think having more places to land affects this in any way. In fact, the longer the available coastline the MORE problems the German barges have....
Just how does that help, germany was limited severely by treaties until Hitler abroagted them.
If you are suggesting Germany does this in the 20's, you are going to have to explain why the allies (in particular the French) arn't sitting in Germany, just for starters.
I'm not suggesting that at all. Just trying to give more time if it helps. If this doesn't help at all then I don't think you're being creative enough.