Hello everyone! I have been a lurker on this forum for a while and i felt like its time for me to post something myself. The AHC is to have the Netherlands reemerge as a great naval power after 1815.
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Thats kind of what i was thinking myself as i always had thought that the dutch really kicked the bucket as a Great Power after the French Revolution. Perhaps if it were to remain united with Belgium it could have been better off.The problem is that during the French occupation if the Netherlands (including in the days of the Batavian Republic and the Kingdom of holland) the Dutch economy was ruined. Actualy the Netherlands was already on the decline during the 18th century. In short the Dutch economy in the 19th century was horrible. It was one of the poorest and least developed countries in western Europe. Basicly, it couldn't afford a huge navy anymore.
You probably at least need Belgium to remain part of the Netherlands and even in that case I think it might not be enough. I don't think the Netherlands can compete with the naval capabilities of Britain, Germany, USA or even France.
Thats kind of what i was thinking myself as i always had thought that the dutch really kicked the bucket as a Great Power after the French Revolution. Perhaps if it were to remain united with Belgium it could have been better off.
Unlikely that the Netherlands will be a 'Great Power' but never the less it could have larger fleet after 1860.
The efforts to build a fleet after 1860 were already considerable for a minor power as the Netherlands but never the less it could be more.
In OTL around 1880 it had a relative modern fleet of 6 iron clad ships (4 turret ships with 1 turret and 2 ships with 2 turrets)
Late during the 1890ties early 1900 it had a small fleet of armored cruisers.
It could be well possible that from the 1870 onward it build a fleet of larger units and with more numbers. Reason could be the Spanish-American war , the Chino-Japanese war and ultimately the Russo-Japanese war.
In all it would be a 'fleet in being' not a 'Great Power' fleet, but never the less it would be a political statement.
Funds and resources were available, considering that in the 1880-1890 the Netherlands spent fortunes on the construction of fortresses around Amsterdam, this could be allocated to the Navy.
Yes the Dutch could build a large fleet but the question is WHY? The naval great powers of the 19th century weren't a real threat to the Dutch. They weren't involved in any of the European power plays and the only nation that ended up being perceived as a threat was Germany, which was primarily a land power. No way the US, Japan or Russia would try to conquer the Dutch East Indies in the 19th century. At that point the British would probably intervene, since it wouldn't be in London's interest to have the East Indies fall to any of those three powers. Sorry but I just can't see the why for a larger Dutch navy.
You are correct, but the attitude of the late 19th century Dutch cabinets was that, even an attack of USA, Japan, Russia or in the extreme unlike even UK or France, should be capable of defending it overseas possession on their own. Beside this, they thought, you only can count on foreign aid if you make serious investments in defense on you own. In OTL they did, but it could be with a bit larger units. The navy units at the end of the 19th century where , as contemporary observers remarked, ' beautiful ships only a bit small and under gunned'
I called it a ''fleet in being' which could be some 6 heavy units (battle ships) and 6 light units (cruisers) A bit like the 8-8 fleet plan of Japan at the turn of the century.
Ah I see what your saying. The only problem I can see is London. Remember when Kaiser Wilhelm started building his dream navy shit hit the fan in Britain, and basically destroyed all do relations. So the Dutch would either have to keep the fleet small enough that London doesn't see it as a threat or station the vast majority of it in the East Indies.
I think london would see the dutch as a threat if they were to be in alliance with Germany. I mean could you imagine the look on the faces of parliament when they are told that the combined dutch and german fleets could actually take down their fleetI doubt if London sees the Dutch as treat. It could be that most of the hardware to build the large units is bought in the UK just as the Japanese did.
Yes the Dutch could build a large fleet but the question is WHY? The naval great powers of the 19th century weren't a real threat to the Dutch. They weren't involved in any of the European power plays and the only nation that ended up being perceived as a threat was Germany, which was primarily a land power. No way the US, Japan or Russia would try to conquer the Dutch East Indies in the 19th century. At that point the British would probably intervene, since it wouldn't be in London's interest to have the East Indies fall to any of those three powers. Sorry but I just can't see the why for a larger Dutch navy.
A kingdom of the 'United'* Netherlands (*= never officially a part of the name) could have been a bit more active in Africa and the Pacific, which would justify a larger navy.