AHC: Russo-Japanese conflict becomes World War

[zeppelinair]

The challenge is that, with a POD in 1900, alliances between great powers are already in place that when a Russo-Japanese conflict occurs, major powers are dragged into it.

Relevant documents of OTL, before the 1904-1905 conflict:

Treaty of London 1839 1839 - Britain guaranteed Belgian neutrality

Dual Alliance 1879 - Germany's alliance with Austria-Hungary

Three Emperor's League 1881 - Russia's alliance with Germany/Austria-Hungary

Triple Alliance 1882 - Italy joined Germany and Austria-Hungary's alliance

Reinsurance Treaty 1887 - Bismarck's alliance with Russia

France-Russian Military Convention 1892 - French/Russian precursor to Triple Entente alliance

Anglo-Japanese Alliance 1902 - Intended as counterweight to France and Russia

 

[Kaze]

There is also the sinking of the British North Sea Fishing Fleet as a pretext for the war.

 

[zeppelinair]

There is also the sinking of the British North Sea Fishing Fleet as a pretext for the war.

well...true but I doubt the British would consider that as a viable threat to war

 

[BlondieBC]

I think you can back into one. Germany consider invading France as Russia was falling apart. This planning is where much of OTL WW1 battle plan came for. So for a brief ATL.

• German gets A-H backing to knock France down a peg or two.
• German attacks France.
• Russia declares war on Germany despite not having the troops to do much.
• Germany and A-H Declare war on Russia.
• France on A-H.
• Italy and Ottomans go at it.

UK is in a bit of pickle. Have them join one side or another.

 

[Aphrodite]

There is also the sinking of the British North Sea Fishing Fleet as a pretext for the war.

I know this is a favorite POD for an Anglo-Russian War but in reality, there never was any chance of this escalating. The British cabinet had discussed the hope that the Americans might join them to limit Russian gains but there was no interest in a war with Russia. The Russians never considered war with Britain and were immediately conciliatory. There just isn't a diplomatic crisis. The whole thing is just dumped on the Hague and forgotten

I think you can back into one. Germany consider invading France as Russia was falling apart. This planning is where much of OTL WW1 battle plan came for. So for a brief ATL.

• German gets A-H backing to knock France down a peg or two.
• German attacks France.
• Russia declares war on Germany despite not having the troops to do much.
• Germany and A-H Declare war on Russia.
• France on A-H.
• Italy and Ottomans go at it.

UK is in a bit of pickle. Have them join one side or another.

By the time the Germans really considered this, the Anglo-French ties were tight.

Zuber argues that the French advantage up until 1908 is so great that it would be suicidal for Germany to wage war. A backdoor of the Franco-Russians reaching that conclusion and thinking the Germans are secretly backing Japan could lead to them jumping Germany

 

[trajen777]

I know this is a favorite POD for an Anglo-Russian War but in reality, there never was any chance of this escalating. The British cabinet had discussed the hope that the Americans might join them to limit Russian gains but there was no interest in a war with Russia. The Russians never considered war with Britain and were immediately conciliatory. There just isn't a diplomatic crisis. The whole thing is just dumped on the Hague and forgotten




By the time the Germans really considered this, the Anglo-French ties were tight.

Zuber argues that the French advantage up until 1908 is so great that it would be suicidal for Germany to wage war. A backdoor of the Franco-Russians reaching that conclusion and thinking the Germans are secretly backing Japan could lead to them jumping Germany

Actually he did not he argued against a german invasion of France. Late here will write tomm ..

 

[Kaze]

The wounds from the Crimean War and the Afghanistan War were still fresh. So an incident somewhere in that area could bring another British vs Russian war.

 

[Alanith]

Have a RN warship in the area of the fishing fleet. Naturally it steams to their immediate aid, and either sinks a few Russian ships, or takes a few shells from a Russian ship... somehow.