AHC: Prussia doesn't rise to become Austria's rival?

What are the possible PODs that make it that Prussia isn't Austria's rival for German hegemony?

Or, alternatively, how can we make German dualism not exist?
 
Simply have Prussia taken out as an effective nation durring the political-ethnic clusterfuck that was the Baroque era if you want to prevent it rising as a rival. Maybe Poland-Lithuania or Sweden totally stomps 'em into the ground? Maybe an earlier POD where the Teutonic Order never reforms into a more secular body and simply ceases to work as a political machine?

Keeping away German Dualism entirely will probably require butterflying the Reformation. Hard for a number of reasons, political, geographic, and cultural/religious.

Perhaps at the latest a total Austrian victory in the *30 Years War?
 
Simply have Prussia taken out as an effective nation durring the political-ethnic clusterfuck that was the Baroque era if you want to prevent it rising as a rival. Maybe Poland-Lithuania or Sweden totally stomps 'em into the ground? Maybe an earlier POD where the Teutonic Order never reforms into a more secular body and simply ceases to work as a political machine?

Keeping away German Dualism entirely will probably require butterflying the Reformation. Hard for a number of reasons, political, geographic, and cultural/religious.

Perhaps at the latest a total Austrian victory in the *30 Years War?

Would a conquest of Ducal Prussia by Poland do? In OTL it was the Polish king merely accepting them as a vassal state that eventually bit them in the butt in the long run.

Or, if Frederick the Great isn't Frederick the Lucky TTL...
 

Valdemar II

Banned
What are the possible PODs that make it that Prussia isn't Austria's rival for German hegemony?

Or, alternatively, how can we make German dualism not exist?

Well there are a lot of PODs

The soldier king aren't such a army nerd, and waste Prussias state budget on castles building and luxuries.

Maria Theresa are born a boy.

Prussia stay out of War of Austrian Succession

Prussia loses it.

Prussia lose the Seven Year War.

And that just the late PODs

All in all Prussias rise to power demanded a lot of luck, accidents and risk taking.

Personal I like the latest POD best (the 7YW), it would keep weaken the effects of a lack of Prussia and keep Austria on the road of reforms it was in IOTL. It's also the most likely, Prussias survival was a miracle. of course even if the Hohenzollern lose and are reduced to Brandenburg, Magdeburg and Pommern, it will still be a player in the post war phrase, through only on the level of Saxony or Bavaria.
 
I still think that Frederick the Great was more of Frederick the Lucky. Seriously, it seems that the world throws him a bone when he needs it.
 

Valdemar II

Banned
Would a conquest of Ducal Prussia by Poland do? In OTL it was the Polish king merely accepting them as a vassal state that eventually bit them in the butt in the long run.

Or, if Frederick the Great isn't Frederick the Lucky TTL...

Ducal Prussia while a nice source of capital wasn't the fundament for the Prussian state, Brandenburg, Magdeburg and Pommern was. Even if the Hohenzollern didn't have Prussia they would still be able to make the reform which made them so strong.
 
Ducal Prussia while a nice source of capital wasn't the fundament for the Prussian state, Brandenburg, Magdeburg and Pommern was. Even if the Hohenzollern didn't have Prussia they would still be able to make the reform which made them so strong.

It did provide a reason for Frederick to try and connect his domains via eating Poland, though.

Though I suppose another POD could be the Great Elector not being as successful.
 

Valdemar II

Banned
It did provide a reason for Frederick to try and connect his domains via eating Poland, though.

Eating Poland had nothing to do with creating Prussian greatness, it was a result of Prussia succes.

Though I suppose another POD could be the Great Elector not being as successful.

Yes that are a potential one, we could see Brandenburg end up something like Mecklenburg in that case. A state with a weak Prince and a strong knighthood, with a weak army and which was only kept alive, because no wished to remove a worthless buffer state.
 

Valdemar II

Banned
Or Leopold I doesn't give Frederick III/I the title of King in Prussia?

We would likely see the Electorate of Brandenburg gain Silesia in the War of Austrian Succession. Don't make a mistake the name was important, but Netherlands was a major power while under a Stadtholder, while a minor power when it became a kingdom. The biggest problem are that Brandenburg will likely push for become a kingdom another way, like trying to gain the Polish, Swedish or Danish crown.
 
Or Leopold I doesn't give Frederick III/I the title of King in Prussia?
Cheater :p King in Brandenburg, King in Prussia, same thing. Was Prussia being outside the HRE the reason they were made King in Prussia instead of Brandenburg? Or was it just random?
 
Cheater :p King in Brandenburg, King in Prussia, same thing. Was Prussia being outside the HRE the reason they were made King in Prussia instead of Brandenburg? Or was it just random?

That was because there were no other royal titles in the HRE than King of Bohemia (typically held by the Emperor), King of the Germans (same), and King of the Romans (held by the Emperor's heir). Since Prussia wasn't within the HRE...
 
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