Ok, so many people are familiar with the first party system and its demise. The Federalists, after years of inner conflicts and being supplanted by the Democratic-Republicans in the elections since 1800 eventually dissolved over time while the Dem-Reps, who were also starting to fracture during the twilight days of the Era of Good Feelings eventually split apart between Andrew Jackson's Democrats and his opponent's Whigs. So let's just get to the point here: How could we preserve the first part system (both of Feds and the Dem-Reps) for as long as possible? Your POD can be as far back as 1776 and it doesn't necessarily have to survive to the present era, but just a bit longer than IOTL.
AHC: Preserve the first party system for as long as possible
- Thread starter connorCD
- Start date
George Washington
Banned
A Hamilton presidency instead of Adams, XYZ affair elevated into full-scale war. Or, a Hamilton election instead of Madison. New faces. Put Clay and Webster into the Federalists, Jackson and Calhoun into the Democrat-Republicans. Oh, and having a anti-slavery Federalist and pro-slavery Democrat-Republicans. This keep the system alive until 1850's, 1860's, or 1870's. However, after the Civil War (whenever it is, it will happen) the Democrat-Republicans will probably fall or at least become a third party, but they could stay alive as a anti-power party. Federalists could probably stay alive, though weak, until the mid-19th Century and get revived then and be alive and well for a while. The trick would be the Democrat-Republicans, especially to make them not racist or slave-centered, which will be hard to avoid.
1776 makes it easy to at least keep it going a little longer. I did this in my Washington Wins at Brandywine TL. With the REvolution over a few years early, French support wasn't as important as far as reognition, and so Britain versus France wasn't one of the big hangups - the Federalists evolved into something more like OTL's Whigs, while the D-R morphed into more like OTL's Democrats of the same period.
Now in my TL, becasue the Constitution is worked on in 1781, the Carolinas and Georgia leave, so there isn't the slavery issue, so it's probably easier for the U.S. to keep that system longer. It's hard to to keep the party system the same way beyond a TTL Civil War, if there is one, and there almost surely will be one if the Deep South is around. (In mine, Washington, Adams, and Jefferson are shifted 6 years earlier, but due to problems with France and Jefferson being too much of a pacifist in face of French aggression, he is a one-term President. Jay, a Federalist, wins a war against France and S
ain with Britain on the U.S side, then a treasy lets the U.S. keep New Orleans and other gains on the Continent itself, the U.S. "buys" Louisiana after having captured some int he war, etc.. Not officially a member of the Second Coalition but definitely taking advantage. After Madison serve 2 terms and another President 1, Clay wins 2 terms as a Federalist, who ahave become OTL's Whigs with internal improvements, etc.)
I stop in the 1840s, but if I were to continue, the U.S. - which abolishes slavery as of 1850 - will probably see expansion as an important thing, both in size and economy. Would TTL's Federalists (OTL Whigs) become more of a "global power" party, whereas the Democrats are more isolationist? POssibly, it's hard to to take it out really far in such a scenario.
Now in my TL, becasue the Constitution is worked on in 1781, the Carolinas and Georgia leave, so there isn't the slavery issue, so it's probably easier for the U.S. to keep that system longer. It's hard to to keep the party system the same way beyond a TTL Civil War, if there is one, and there almost surely will be one if the Deep South is around. (In mine, Washington, Adams, and Jefferson are shifted 6 years earlier, but due to problems with France and Jefferson being too much of a pacifist in face of French aggression, he is a one-term President. Jay, a Federalist, wins a war against France and S
ain with Britain on the U.S side, then a treasy lets the U.S. keep New Orleans and other gains on the Continent itself, the U.S. "buys" Louisiana after having captured some int he war, etc.. Not officially a member of the Second Coalition but definitely taking advantage. After Madison serve 2 terms and another President 1, Clay wins 2 terms as a Federalist, who ahave become OTL's Whigs with internal improvements, etc.)I stop in the 1840s, but if I were to continue, the U.S. - which abolishes slavery as of 1850 - will probably see expansion as an important thing, both in size and economy. Would TTL's Federalists (OTL Whigs) become more of a "global power" party, whereas the Democrats are more isolationist? POssibly, it's hard to to take it out really far in such a scenario.
I'd argue that one of the main reasons the Federalists declined was because of the factionalism between pro-Hamiltonians and anti-Hamiltonians due to Hamilton's egotistical attitude and controversial beliefs (hence why a Hamilton presidency is very implausible as much as i hate to admit it). That said you could do three things that could atleast help both Alex's career and his party.
A. Avoid the Reynolds affair. That incident really hurt his already fragile reputation and really hurt his chances in official office.
B. Get him to swallow his ego for once and not attack Adams during his reelection. Though given this is Hamilton we're talking about, this is probably the hardest thing to do.
C. Don't get him to any duel that could either end his career or end his life. Even if he managed to kill Burr in their little duel, that probably won't do much good for him.
Skallagrim
Banned
Instead of somehow trying to prevent Hamilton from causing trouble (which he did incessantly, as a result of his core personality) just kill him off shortly after the Constitution is adopted. The Federalist faction already exists, and the nature of the new Constitution (and the powers it bestows upon the Federal government) will certainly impelJefferson et al. to form their opposing faction before long. Thus, the OTL first party system is in place, but Hamilton isn't there to screw his own cause over with his radicalism (which alienated many) and his endlessly conflict-seeking personality (which made powerful enemies). He's more useful to the Federalists as a dead man (presented as an untarnished paragon) than as a live one.
This scenario probably causes tensions to be somewhat more limited between the opposing factions, allowing for more stability. The Federalists are more widely accepted and have a broader (moderate) base of support, and their OTL implosion is avoided.
This scenario probably causes tensions to be somewhat more limited between the opposing factions, allowing for more stability. The Federalists are more widely accepted and have a broader (moderate) base of support, and their OTL implosion is avoided.
In hindsight, the Federalists were already on a downward spiral by the time of 1812. Maybe they could survive for a few more years if i didn't happen, but it's generally agreed that it wouldn't last by that point.
Cool. So what exactly could the presidential lineup be in a world where Hamilton dies earlier? I think It'd still be possible for Adams to lose reelection in 1800 (though the chance of that happening are much less than OTL) but who has the chance of replacing Jefferson? Pinckney?
Is there any way that, between a combination of no 1812, @Skallagrim's scenario, or whatever else necessary, to have the elements that eventually coalesced into the National Republican/Whig parties join the Federalists instead of forming new parties?
Perhaps. I think a few Federalists and ex-Federalists were anti-slavery (though not all of them were abolitionists) and may have had some other policies that carried onto the Whigs/Nat-Reps/Republicans. I could see notable people like John Quincy Adams and Daniel Webster remaining in a surviving, stronger Federalist party (and maybe throw in Henry Clay in there, though him being a Fed would probably require him having a slightly different political career).
Skallagrim
Banned
Without Hamilton, it's likely that the Federalists (being more moderate) aren't going to introduce OTL's alien & sedition acts. This will take some wind out of Jefferson's sails. The Federalists are still going to run into opposition. The Jeffersonian take-over might be delayed by a few years.
The Federalist candidate to eventually succeed Jefferson may be... the same guy who succeeded him in OTL. Hamilton alienated Madison, too. Without that, Madison may well remain a moderate Federalist instead of hitching his wagon to Jefferson's party. In which case you presumably get a "no war of 1812" scenario by default, since ATL Madison would probably attempt to emulate "Washingtonian" neutrality instead of picking a fight with either Britain or France.
Either way, the Jeffersonian faction either is in power 1800-1808 or 1804-1812. I don't see OTL's enduring supremacy of his party materialising with a healthier, broader Federalist opposition in play. And with a stronger Federalist Party (also in Congress), Jefferson wouldn't be in a position to push for a war against Britain. He'd lean pro-France as in OTL, but no more. After he's out of power again, his Federalist successor would lean pro-Britain, but again-- no more than that.