AHC: Ottoman Empire falls by 1815

Weren't the Giray khans of the Crimea the recognised next in line if the Osmanli dynasty died out?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

That'd give the Russians an excellent excuse for setting up their own puppet state with a khan as monarch. If the Osman dynaty dies out and civil war erupts the Russians would peobably use whatever excuse they could to constantinople, the second Rome, mediterranian access and all that.
 
Provinces Illyriennes yes, but that's close to Italy, and the coast. It would be harder to really hold the inland.

Plus trying so would be alienating to the austrians
 
Weren't the Giray khans of the Crimea the recognised next in line if the Osmanli dynasty died out?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

Not really. The Ottoman Empire never really had an official line of succession, even when it was more or less operating by what we would call Agnatic Seniority. The Girays were frequently mooted at various crisis points as a potential successor for the Ottomans, due to the lineage's prestige, but they were never alone in this.

Indeed, they might just go for the Sokolluzades, who are Ottoman descendants from the female line.
 
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raharris1973

Gone Fishin'
Donor
Monthly Donor
One could argue that the late 18th/early 19th century is the doable time for eliminating the Ottoman Empire, even more so than the period within which it was actually eliminated IOTL.

Provincial governors are setting up their own borderline-independent fiefdoms left and right; the army is weakened by a long and grueling reform process; even the Jannisaries are still around and they're at the peak of their counter-productivity; the subjugated peoples are even more restless and quick to revolt than they will be later on.

If multiple great powers concentrate on attacking the Ottoman Empire in such a state, who knows what might happen.

Well, Prussia's intervention/demand for compensation was a big factor causing Leopold's Austria from backing off of its Ottoman war. So, perhaps Ottoman partition would be a fairly plausible knock-on consequence of any of the frequent "Prussia is crushed in 7 Years War" threads, like disaster at Leuthen. If there's an Austro-Russian consensus in the 18th century to grind down the Ottomans, and no Prussia or France in a position to do anything about, they might go as far as they want.
 
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Well, Frederick the Great's intervention/demand for compensation was a big factor causing Leopold's Austria from backing off of its Ottoman war. So, perhaps Ottoman partition would be a fairly plausible knock-on consequence of any of the frequent "Prussia is crushed in 7 Years War" threads, like disaster at Leuthen. If there's an Austro-Russian consensus in the 18th century to grind down the Ottomans, and no Prussia or France in a position to do anything about, they might go as far as they want.

Umm...

What?

Leopold and Frederick the Great... weren't contemporaries.

Unless you mean Leopold II, and he didn't become Emperor until Frederick was... quite a few years in the ground.
 
Umm...

What?

Leopold and Frederick the Great... weren't contemporaries.

Unless you mean Leopold II, and he didn't become Emperor until Frederick was... quite a few years in the ground.
I assume he mean's Leopold II.
Fredrick would never have been at Reichenbach, or any of the Austro-Prussian summits; his father left it in his memoirs to him that "No enemy truly ever forgives, and no conquered territory becomes [assimilated] in one generation." So he wasn't trustworthy of the Austrians.
 

raharris1973

Gone Fishin'
Donor
Monthly Donor
Scratch Frederick the Great and replace with "Prussia". Bottom-line, Austrians can do more against the Ottoman Empire if they don't have to worry as much about Prussia. And a crushing of Prussia in the 1750s or 1760s, could mean no Austrian looking over their shoulder and having to pause if they fight the Ottomans in the 1780s.

One could go with earlier PoDs in the 18th century as well. For example, Prussia never has a leader with the guts to grab Silesia. Austria is not absorbed in three wars trying to take it back. Austria can work harder to make conquests against the Ottomans and make them stick.
 
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