AHC: Odrysian Kingdom centralized

my chalange: how can we create a Thracian kingdom united under one king who has real centralized rule

I know the history of the Odrysian kingdom is filled with murder and manny kings and chiefs, but was there anny of them capable to unite the tribes, even for a moment?

double the points iff they manage to keep their (already threatend) form of freedom a bit longer.

tripple iff they dont get completly Helenized (damm..I hate the word XD)

my thanks, for this would really help me out;)
 
The most I know personally of the Odrysian Kingdom was the King at that time rebelling against Rome and throwing support behind Mithridates in the First Mithridatic War. It seems like the last chance they would have had at anything close to independance probably as a tributary monarchy of Pontus had they won after the kingdom had already shattered into three smaller realms.

Then again perhaps full annexation under the Persian Empire in Darius' time during his brief adventure into Scythia would have helped centre power in a ruling satrap. A long period of unbroken rule may have allowed an established family to concentrate administration, though ultimately it may all come crashing down with the occasional raids from other tribes, Macedons rise or the eventaul migrations of the celtic peoples.

Actually, that gives me an idea. A ruling satrap of Odyrsia, prefarably an eastern ruler or Persian prince, sees the Thracians as the ferocious warriors they are during a rebellion against his rule. Their unusual and effective weapons rip through the wicker shields of his garrisons, but he eventually defeats the rebellion. As a result the practice of hiring or Thracians armed with the infamous falx becomes almost as universal as the Galatian mercenaries in the wars between the Diadochi throughout the Persian Empire.
Thrace becomes a famous hiring ground of mercenaries in Persia and the Satraps willing to get their cut vie for control of the region to keep it under Persian power.
 
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Actually, that gives me an idea. A ruling satrap of Odyrsia, prefarably an eastern ruler or Persian prince, sees the Thracians as the ferocious warriors they are during a rebellion against his rule. Their unusual and effective weapons rip through the wicker shields of his garrisons, but he eventually defeats the rebellion. As a result the practice of hiring or Thracians armed with the infamous falx becomes almost as universal as the Galatian mercenaries in the wars between the Diadochi throughout the Persian Empire.
Thrace becomes a famous hiring ground of mercenaries in Persia and the Satraps willing to get their cut vie for control of the region to keep it under Persian power.

this gives me plenty of ideas:D

could it also work with other ITTL kingdoms?
I have a TL in progress, and Thrace was really a blind spot:eek:
 
It depends largely on when exactly your timeline occurs, if you want a united Thrace.

Darius subjugated the area briefly and most of the coastline of the Black Sea before marching across the Danube into Scythia and discovering that invading Russia even before it exists is rather unwise.
The difficulty of Persian satrapies is that they will rely on existing infastructure and so you will have rule from Greek colonies along the coasts while the hinterlands will remain relatively untouched.
Kings or chieftans can pay homage or tribute but unless pressed will do very little to encourage loyalty unless threatened by military presence.

The Athenians and Spartans were happy to ignore the Thracians during the Peloponnesian Wars. Philip subjugated the them and built new cities to control these lands, Alexander after him continued with the subjugation.

Lysimachus had the opportunity to "tame" the wild Thracians and forge a kingdom but he went crazy and incredibly paranoid, killing his son and wife. The other Diadochi picked apart his realm in his moment of weakness and his kingdom essentially collapsed.

The Celtic invasions left the area so devestated that all of northern Greece and Thrace was the roaming grounds of Celtic warbands towards the end of the 4th century bc. The Celts for a long time practically ruled Thrace and went on to create Galatia in Asia Minor.

Galatia was seperated into several tribal areas who often fought against each other when not raiding the surrounding kingdoms.
It became a cohesive kingdom when Mithridates plan to kill their leaders at a poison banquet backfired when the last cheiftain alive united the tribes against him and declared himself king.

Some similar event in your timeline where the other leaders would be killed by an external threat could unite a people into a nation.

Perhaps being wedged between a rising Macedon and a decaying Persian Empire could help the Thracians realise that they have to unite or be crushed by their old enemies the Hellenics.

If you go for the Persian satrap model a few important things need to be accounted for. If Persia holds the Bosporus they can cut off the vital grain trade of the Spartocids in the Bosphoran Kingdom in Crimea which much of Hellas greatly relied upon for food. They could use it as blackmail to prevent Athens attacking them.

Also the Thracians religion will be important. Perhaps a king can use the Thracians monotheisitic faith, Zalmoxianism to claim an early form of divine right. One god, one king or whatever. I always find it a shame none of the Hellenics were terribly interested in documenting the religion of Thrace. The reason they were seen as such ferocious warriors is that they truely believed that they would go to an afterlife paradise when they died. Ancient religious fanatics with armour piercing swords. Given the right conditions they could have been a great power and spread a mighty religion across the world.

Good Luck on your timeline. I hope I have answered your question or at least given you something to work with.
 
Well, by giving all these Ideas, I can only say Thanks:D

Thrace was a real blind spot, and yet all important for my timeline to work out properly. with this, I can really get to the good parts quickly, maybe even post parts during the summer months.

thanks again, and a lot;);)
 
Gordius:

Where did you get that information about Thracian religion from? Everything I have read implies that they were polytheistic just like the rest of Europe at the time, though the cult of Ares (or Thrax) was particularly prevalent there.
 
Herodotus when writing of the Getai spoke about them believing in their own immortality, that when they died they went to Zalmoxis. He mentions that Zalmoxis was a slave of Pythagoras, who also held some unusual religious beliefs during his time so perhaps his ideas influenced the soon to be prophet when he returned home.
Herodotus also said they fired arrows and beat their swords on their shields during thunder storms and yelled out curses denying the thunder as not their god, though it may be more figurative than something that actually happened.

The greeks rather than try to discover much about local religions just assumed the gods of their neighbours or those they conquered were facets of their own superior Greek gods, hence Ahura Mazda of Zoroastrianism was known as Zeus Stratios temples of Ishtar in the East were Aphrodite and the Sythians worshipped Ares by planting swords in the ground etc. The Romans continued this tradition as can be seen in Julius Caesar declaring the Gauls worshipped Mercury as their head god rather than name their god in the celtic tongue.

Herodotus may have just thought the Getai, who were a sub tribe of the Thracians, worshipped a man rather than a god which is why he is specifiaclly named Zalmoxis rather than reinterperet him as one of their own.
 
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