AHC- no Chinese decline

Okay, time to throw down the Zheng He Cliche Card :D

If China needs awareness that they're actually in a tech race, could continued Treasure Fleet expeditions through the next couple generations of Emperors that reach Europe and note the growing naval might and decide that continued naval and tech growth is in their best interest?
If we push up European infiltration of the Indian Ocean (or pull back *Zhenghe programs) a century or two maybe there could be competition there. Europe isn't in the Chinese sphere of influence at this point, so if there are nice boats there I wouldn't think the Chinese would spurt up.

But if European traders threaten the Indian Ocean trade, which Zheng He was working on making the Chinese sphere of influence, the idea of backwardness is easier to justify.
 
If we push up European infiltration of the Indian Ocean (or pull back *Zhenghe programs) a century or two maybe there could be competition there. Europe isn't in the Chinese sphere of influence at this point, so if there are nice boats there I wouldn't think the Chinese would spurt up.

But if European traders threaten the Indian Ocean trade, which Zheng He was working on making the Chinese sphere of influence, the idea of backwardness is easier to justify.

Hence the "continued...through the next couple generations of Emperors" statement in my post. ;)
 
Okay, time to throw down the Zheng He Cliche Card :D

If China needs awareness that they're actually in a tech race, could continued Treasure Fleet expeditions through the next couple generations of Emperors that reach Europe and note the growing naval might and decide that continued naval and tech growth is in their best interest?

Basically I agree. But not because Chinese travellers might reach Europe. It's the Middle East that China really needed to get in touch with. The Arab world was by Zheng He's time already a technological peer with China.

Certainly Al-Jazari's Book of Ingenius Devices described mechanical engineering that would be a revelation to Chinese engineers. The Chinese imported eye-glasses from the Middle East, but had no knowlege to make it domestically. In fields of astronomy, physics, chemistry, optics, mathematics, the Arabs were all ahead. China in contrast did not even know the world was round, nor did it knew of the Scientific Method.

So right there was a civilization which should teach China that it was not supreme in all things, and in fact Zheng He's fleet had repeatedly visited and traded with. But the Ming Treasure Fleet was not out on a scientific expedition, these discoveries for the most part were not made by Chinese sailors and their eunuch administrators. They had just scratched the surface of what the Middle East had to offer when the fleet was ordered home for good.

There are other PODs. The Mongol Yuan Dynasty actually brought a great deal of Arab craftsmen and traders to China. The Mongols also had a great appreciation for Islamic technological achievements. Had that dynasty lasted longer, invariably China would see the world differently. Instead the Ming dynasty drew the wrong conclusion from Mongol occupation. It believed the super conservative Neo-Confucian Song Dynasty was the acme of Chinese achievement, only to be destroyed by the Mongols. The Ming set out to erase Mongol influences and recreate the Song. Except for a brief period of maritime experimentation, the Ming set China on the course of introspection and isolation.
 
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