AHC: New dynasty supercedes Habsburgs, but holds Austria-Hungary-Bohemia together

raharris1973

Gone Fishin'
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Monthly Donor
That's the challenge, have a territorial configuration similar in its core territories to what the Austria after the the Jagiellonian inheritance through Austria-Hungary in Europe, but have more than one dynasty, include one without the Habsburg name in it rule over the whole territorial block.

I think the Habsburgs actually became the Habsburg-Lorraines, but I'm actually looking for a greater difference, where the dynasties are as different from each other as the Plantagenets and Tudors, or Capetians, Valois or Bourbons.

The territorial realm holding together under some form of non-monarchical government would also meet the challenge.
 
That's the challenge, have a territorial configuration similar in its core territories to what the Austria after the the Jagiellonian inheritance through Austria-Hungary in Europe, but have more than one dynasty, include one without the Habsburg name in it rule over the whole territorial block.

I think the Habsburgs actually became the Habsburg-Lorraines, but I'm actually looking for a greater difference, where the dynasties are as different from each other as the Plantagenets and Tudors, or Capetians, Valois or Bourbons.

The territorial realm holding together under some form of non-monarchical government would also meet the challenge.
You do realize that the Valois and Bourbons ARE Capetians right?

As for transition from the Plantagenets to the Tudors,that's pretty much the same as the transition from the Habsburgs to the House of Lorraine.
 

raharris1973

Gone Fishin'
Donor
Monthly Donor
hmm, well I guess that's why they called Louis XVI Citizen Louis Capet at the time of his execution, because of the family link.

As for transition from the Plantagenets to the Tudors,that's pretty much the same as the transition from the Habsburgs to the House of Lorraine.

Did they have equal continuity with subsequent dynasties, like Stuarts, the Orange guy and the Hanoverians (named Saxe-Coburg-Gotha & Windsor at different times).

Could we somehow get the Austrian empire get widely known as the Lorrainian Empire at some point?
 

Asami

Banned
hmm, well I guess that's why they called Louis XVI Citizen Louis Capet at the time of his execution, because of the family link.



Did they have equal continuity with subsequent dynasties, like Stuarts, the Orange guy and the Hanoverians (named Saxe-Coburg-Gotha & Windsor at different times).

Could we somehow get the Austrian empire get widely known as the Lorrainian Empire at some point?

Austria as a name was tied to the core of the empire -- Österreich (Eastern March). For it to be "Lorrainian Empire" would require the center of power to be in Lorraine.
 
I suppose a possible TL occurs in the Thirty Years' War, where widespread agitation against the zealous Catholic attitudes of Ferdinand II means that Bohemia refuses to confirm Ferdinand's position as King of Bohemia (instead of confirming him first and then trying to depose him later, as in OTL) and elect a Protestant as their king instead - ideally a Protestant Austrian lord, of which there were a respectable amount in the 17th Century.

Ferdinand II, predictably, takes this badly and prepares to attack Bohemia. The prospect of Protestants having to fight Protestants (Austria and Bohemia having large protestant populations before the 30 Years' War) is abhorrent to the Austrian lords and, in response, they depose Ferdinand II from his position as Archduke of Austria. Since this is a blatant violation of accepted practice in the HRE this gives a good enough casus belli for the likes of Spain to intervene. Adhering to the idea that 'we all hang together or we hang separately', the Austrian lords invite the Bohemian King to be their Archduke as well.

Once Bohemia and Austria are united under one monarch it's only a matter of procedure for the Kingdom of Hungary to fall under the joint monarchy's purview as well, though obviously Gabriel Bethlen will contest the position.
 
Philip the Handsome dies before having any child with Joanna of Aragon, but his sister Margaret and her husband John, Prince of Asturias, live and have many children. Maximilian I fails to have any more children, and so it's agreed that his Austrian inheritance will fall to the second son of John and Margaret. This son (let's call him Ferdinand) marries a Jagellonian princess (the ITTL Anne Jagellonica), and due to the eventual lack of male heirs to the line of Vladislaus II her husband is elected king of Bohemia and Hungary. There you have: a Trastamara Austria-Hungary-Bohemia (or von Spanien, maybe).
 
I think the problem with this idea is the fact that the Habsburg monarchy was a personal union until 1804 and even then each state maintained their own laws and customs. While I can see Austria and Bohemia remaining in union even after the Habsburgs (easily enough really, just have the Bavarians win the Succession war in the 1740s), Hungary is the real problem. They're going to try to break away any chance they get. While a 30 years war POD could work, it will be difficult as the Turks will try to set up a vassal Hungarian state again, which could end up more popular than a continued union with Vienna.
 
Did they have equal continuity with subsequent dynasties, like Stuarts, the Orange guy and the Hanoverians (named Saxe-Coburg-Gotha & Windsor at different times).

Quick clarification for you. It goes like this in Britain:

The Stuarts
William of Orange (whose wife was a Stuart btw, and he himself a grandson of a Stuart)
Anne (a Stuart)
The Hanovers, through Sophia of Hanover.
The Saxe-Coburg and Gothas, because Queen Victoria married Prince Albert.
The Windsors, because Saxe-Coburg was too German.
 
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