AHC: Make West Virginia an Independent Nation
- Thread starter superjames1992
- Start date
Kaiphranos
Donor
Are we presuming a Confederate victory here? Because an independent West Virginia would be a little strange if entirely surrounded by the US...
Unless it turned into a Russian Civil War-type Scenario, it could be knowns as Appalachia.
The Republic of West Virginia began its troubled life as a border state in the American Civil War, having broken away from Virginia proper and reentered the union on the condition that it would not be occupied militarily or forced to supply conscripts for the war effort. When these conditions were broken, they joined the ill-fated attempt of Kentucky to secede from the United States and form their own country, certain that the other border states would follow and that similar secessions were eminent in New York and the Midwest. However, when this glorious revolution against being conscripted into the fight of rich Northern industrialists against rich Southern planters failed to materialize, Kentucky caved while West Virginia was sacrificed on the altar of restoring law and order by the newly established US dictator, General George McClellan.
Following the eventual collapse of the Confederate States under a crushing weight of conscripted flesh, "The Young Napoleon" McClellan and the staff officers who had laid the groundwork for his seizure of emergency powers for the duration set about creating a General Staff on the Prussian model; the institution that would run the country after he was gone. The war had so exhausted the country, and the political instability driven away prospective immigrants, that the remainder of the 1870's went by without any significant strain in industrial relations; with the major problem of industry instead being the lack of manpower due to the bloody toll of the war. The general had cemented his hold on the country with his victory over the Secessionists, but had been all too happy to allow a system of barely paid sharecropping to take the place of slavery in the South. Further more restrictions on internal movement by the military, meant to quell unrest, hampered the flow of men to industrial centers. Instead, the leading cartels had to approach the General Staff in groups and put forward their organized plans for moving industry to the sources of labor, with the 1880's seeing American industrial growth moving away from the coasts and major river ports to further inland; including to West Virginia.
The West Virginians had been cruelly beaten, but never broken. The concentrated push of the industrial cartels to exploit their labor for new factories conveniently close to the coal-mines led to the rapid growth of trade unionism there, something which had been simmering throughout the rest of the nation since the end of the rebellion.
When Eugene Victor Debs of the Amalgamated Railroad Union declared a wildcat strike in 1898, shutting down all rail traffic East of Chicago as retribution for the General Staff approving nation-wide cuts in the standards of living and civil liberties of the workers as proposed by the cartels, the fires of rebellion followed the iron-horse to West Virginia, where they found ample kindling. The Appalachian Republican Brotherhood, an illegal underground organization, had been using the West Virginia locals of the ARU as a front; using their instructions throughout the 90's to organize the factory workers and miners as a cover for a second, deeper level of organizing of secessionist intent. The Great Strike provided them with the movement they had been waiting for, a time for revolution.
Following the eventual collapse of the Confederate States under a crushing weight of conscripted flesh, "The Young Napoleon" McClellan and the staff officers who had laid the groundwork for his seizure of emergency powers for the duration set about creating a General Staff on the Prussian model; the institution that would run the country after he was gone. The war had so exhausted the country, and the political instability driven away prospective immigrants, that the remainder of the 1870's went by without any significant strain in industrial relations; with the major problem of industry instead being the lack of manpower due to the bloody toll of the war. The general had cemented his hold on the country with his victory over the Secessionists, but had been all too happy to allow a system of barely paid sharecropping to take the place of slavery in the South. Further more restrictions on internal movement by the military, meant to quell unrest, hampered the flow of men to industrial centers. Instead, the leading cartels had to approach the General Staff in groups and put forward their organized plans for moving industry to the sources of labor, with the 1880's seeing American industrial growth moving away from the coasts and major river ports to further inland; including to West Virginia.
The West Virginians had been cruelly beaten, but never broken. The concentrated push of the industrial cartels to exploit their labor for new factories conveniently close to the coal-mines led to the rapid growth of trade unionism there, something which had been simmering throughout the rest of the nation since the end of the rebellion.
When Eugene Victor Debs of the Amalgamated Railroad Union declared a wildcat strike in 1898, shutting down all rail traffic East of Chicago as retribution for the General Staff approving nation-wide cuts in the standards of living and civil liberties of the workers as proposed by the cartels, the fires of rebellion followed the iron-horse to West Virginia, where they found ample kindling. The Appalachian Republican Brotherhood, an illegal underground organization, had been using the West Virginia locals of the ARU as a front; using their instructions throughout the 90's to organize the factory workers and miners as a cover for a second, deeper level of organizing of secessionist intent. The Great Strike provided them with the movement they had been waiting for, a time for revolution.
Nothing physically impossible.
Nothing really implausible, members of the military staff were talking about an officer needing to stage a coup, and McClellan was associated with this.
Cursory accounting for butterflies, Pullman Strike isn't about Pullman cars, is several years later than OTL, and the ARU is not the American Railroad Union but the Amalgamated Railroad Union.
Improbable, yes, incredibly. But not implausible. It is perfectly plausible that McClellan could have established a dictatorship and that West Virginia could become secessionist due to its dealings with the outside world. It is however very improbable, which is to say unlikely. It does not stretch the bounds of plausibility in any way, in my opinion, these are all things that could have happened in our history.
Nothing really implausible, members of the military staff were talking about an officer needing to stage a coup, and McClellan was associated with this.
Cursory accounting for butterflies, Pullman Strike isn't about Pullman cars, is several years later than OTL, and the ARU is not the American Railroad Union but the Amalgamated Railroad Union.
Improbable, yes, incredibly. But not implausible. It is perfectly plausible that McClellan could have established a dictatorship and that West Virginia could become secessionist due to its dealings with the outside world. It is however very improbable, which is to say unlikely. It does not stretch the bounds of plausibility in any way, in my opinion, these are all things that could have happened in our history.
I'd really like a link to anything describing an officers coup.
Extremely implausible, and that's just with the whole "McClellan successfully launches a military coup."
And then we get into the Confederate defeated "under a crushing weight of conscripted flesh" (that kind of crude bludgeoning strategy is going inspire revolt in the North to replace this incompetent dictator), McClellan setting up a Prussian style general staff to succeed him (because...why?), the US just happily accepting this (and no, the army is not going to side with Little Mac trying to impose this)...
Really, this may not be physically impossible in the sense of me growing wings and flying, but it is more of a Sealion than a Confederate capture of DC in 1863.
"Some officers were talking about the need for a military coup, possibly while in their cups, and certainly not to the point of even limited mutiny" does not translate into anything like this scenario.
I would say the time period to look at is not the Civil War, but the period right after independence. Some issue between the folks on the frontier and the new power along the coast. Too much taxes? always a classic. Or maybe the US govt siding with Indian claims on the land against the settlers?
EDIT: Whoops. I didn't see that the OP specified "after the civil war". My bad.
EDIT: Whoops. I didn't see that the OP specified "after the civil war". My bad.
Someone compares my work to Stephanie Meyers without giving any reason why, any supporting details at all, any argument, just a blatant out and out troll-post; and I respond constructively because he has seniority, and your problem is with my well supported point and not his completely unsupported point?
What well supported point? There is no evidence I know of that Little Mac or anyone else was planning any sort of military coup OTL.
I'd say your best bet is a Confederate Victory scenario where the independence of West Virginia is a compromise between its forcible reincorporation into Virginia and remaining part of the Union. This probably requires British intervention and a British-dictated peace that is perceived from London to be fair to both sides.
In fairness, as the one who compared the historical plausibility of his post to Twilight-level work, I think John could have been clearer on how he sees Laplace's post as the one full of holes.
I just want a link to something saying that Little Mac was planning a coup, thats all Im interested in.
How about a direct quote referenced to in multiple different contemporary books on the subject?
I have the sources....I have all the sources! Unlimited Powerrrr!
http://www.google.co.uk/search?tbm=...+could+become+dictator+or+anything+else&btnG=
And what is better than just a direct source? It is a direct source linked to from a previous AH.com thread: https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=184663&page=2
Them apples, your satisfaction, etc.
I have the sources....I have all the sources! Unlimited Powerrrr!
http://www.google.co.uk/search?tbm=...+could+become+dictator+or+anything+else&btnG=
And what is better than just a direct source? It is a direct source linked to from a previous AH.com thread: https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=184663&page=2
Them apples, your satisfaction, etc.