AHC: Kyushu and Honshu Japanese branch into separate and distinct nationalities

raharris1973

Gone Fishin'
Donor
Monthly Donor
How far back in time would we need to reach to create and perpetuate such a divide?

Can Japan develop in such a way that the Japonic languages and national self-identifications on each major island are at least as distinct from each other as the Norwegians, Swedes, Danes and Icelanders?

Can we perhaps alter the islands' history so much that even if Yamato Japanese eventually rule the archipelago, there are other nationalities/languages on the island at least as district from the Japanese as the Scots, Welsh and Irish are from the English?
 
The people of Kyushu were likely Austronesian (and thus as non-Japanese as the Ainu) at one point, although by the Nara period they had been thoroughly assimilated into the Yamato people.

Arguably the Ryukyuans count for this.
 

PhilippeO

Banned
Main Problem is Japanese Inner Sea. Japanese Inner Sea is relatively safe and become highway for trade, population movement and culture exchange. old Yamato had govern Kyushu before they fully conquer Kanto plains.
 

Zachariah

Banned
How about either having the Hayato Rebellion (720-721CE) be successful, or having Prince Yamato Takeru fail in his attempt to assassinate the last leader of the Kumaso, Torishi-Kaya, aka Brave of Kahakami, at a banquet in the winter of 397 (perhaps by having him or one of the other warriors in his camp seeing through Prince Takeru's disguise as a woman)?
 

raharris1973

Gone Fishin'
Donor
Monthly Donor
How about either having the Hayato Rebellion (720-721CE) be successful, or having Prince Yamato Takeru fail in his attempt to assassinate the last leader of the Kumaso, Torishi-Kaya, aka Brave of Kahakami, at a banquet in the winter of 397 (perhaps by having him or one of the other warriors in his camp seeing through Prince Takeru's disguise as a woman)?

Whoa - interesting post, it refers to incidents I had never heard of but which sound pretty important for Japanese history.
 
I had this idea about Japan experiencing a very serious political crisis just before the Mongols arrive, even to the extent where there could be some collaborators in Kyushu waiting for them. Mongols would land successfully on Kyushu and pacify the area, but eventually clans on Honshu would unite and would prevent the invasion from continuing towards north in some grand battle. During following centuries Kyushu would experience a wave of cultural influences from the Asian Mainland. Maybe some European nation could even conquer the island at some point and Christianize it? By 20th century culture on Kyushu would be very different from Honshu, and similar to how English and some other widespread languages have developed, there could be two different standards for Japanese languages.

...or having Prince Yamato Takeru fail in his attempt to assassinate the last leader of the Kumaso, Torishi-Kaya, aka Brave of Kahakami, at a banquet in the winter of 397 (perhaps by having him or one of the other warriors in his camp seeing through Prince Takeru's disguise as a woman)?

I would take any of claimed events happening over 100 years before Kojiki and Nihon Shoki were compiled with a spoonful of salt. There were historical sources older than those but unfortunately they have disappeared or were destroyed as the Yamato clan continued to solidify its power. With events in the 4th century, you have already entered more a realm of mythology than actual history. Although the event might have some basis on actual historical events, its memory was most likely heavily distorted by the time it was actually written down. It's actually unclear what sort of centralized power Japan even had at the time and how geographically widespread it was, or where it was even located.

(For those interested in the topic, I would recommend The Emergence of Japanese Kingship by Joan R. Piggott. It combines quite excellently archaeological, historical and more mythical sources about this very early period of Japanese history.)
 
Top