AHC: Islamic Ireland

[Zachariah]

I present you all with a challenge- with any POD after 743 AD (125 AH), create an ATL in which Islam manages to overtake Christianity's early lead, and becomes the predominant faith of the Irish population (with more than 50% of the population of Ireland adhering to Islam) by the present day. Are you up to it?

 

[Isfendil]

What in the name of God...

Spoiler: Joke Suggestion

Here's a possibility: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Years_of_Rice_and_Salt

 

[Zireael]

A-S-B. *shoo*

 

[Isfendil]

A-S-B. *shoo*

So is this, frankly.

 

[Monter]

By the 700s Ireland was already deep in the Christian camp, so the only way to Islamize the island would be through conquest.

 

[DominusNovus]

Constantinople is sieged again shortly after hour POD, and falls to the Muslims. Then, Islam gradually spreads, in fits and starts, across Europe, aided by the eastern peoples converting.

 

[Zachariah]

Alright then- conquest. Sounds simple enough. So when and how might an Islamic expansion into Ireland have the greatest chance of enduring success?

 

[Zachariah]

Constantinople is sieged again shortly after hour POD, and falls to the Muslims. Then, Islam gradually spreads, in fits and starts, across Europe, aided by the eastern peoples converting.

I dunno- wouldn't that mean that they'd have to bulldoze through the entirety of Europe first, taking the long way round, and reaching Ireland last of all? I'd have thought that a more expansionist Al-Andalus might be a more suitable and realistic option, sailing across the Bay of Biscay and the Celtic Sea to mount a colonial effort just before or soon after the Vikings arrive, with both the Vikings and the Andalusians entering alliances with Irish rulers and fighting to extend their rule over Ireland- before the Vikings are left in disarray after the deaths of Olaf the White and Ivar the Boneless, making it easy for the Andalusians to drive the Vikings out instead of the native Irish clan rulers, and secure their forts and settlements for themselves. From there, surely it shouldn't be too hard for the Islamic Andalusians to extend their effective rule over the entire island, and to commence the process of religious conversion in earnest...

 

[Drunkrobot]

If Al-Andulus keeps its borders at the Pyrenees, then a future son of the Umayyads, with naval ability but no prospect of inheritance, decides to lead a conquest of Ireland by the sea? Once his hold on the island is firm it would be hard for a Crusade to be organised and succeed, especially if England is looking pear-shaped at this time.

 

[theg*ddam*hoi2fan]

What in the name of God...

Spoiler: Joke Suggestion

Here's a possibility: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Years_of_Rice_and_Salt

Either this, or the rest of Europe being Islamic. Ireland becoming Muslim on its own is ASB, especially given how peripheral the island is.

Plus, if some ASB suddenly made everyone in Ireland convert...well, Christian England is right next door... They'd be invading before you could say Deus vult...

 

[The Tai-Pan]

So is this, frankly.

A-S-B. *shoo*

ASB is magic, not stuff you don't like or think is possible.


But I do admit the timeline makes this tough. Perhaps a Muslim Spain that becomes a major colonizing/sea power? Still not easy, but a start.

 

[SRT]

I wrote a TL forever ago that I never posted, but it involved a maritime-focused Emirate of Cordoba starting Muslim colonies along the coast of OTL France, England, and Ireland in the early middle ages, eventually protecting trade against Vikings and converting people.

 

[Escape Zeppelin]

For this to happen all of western Europe would have to convert. Hypothetically possible but it's a bit like asking for a Christian China. There are so many steps and PODs required that the butterflies are huge and carnivorous.

It's certainly doable but I think this would require a POD well before Islam existed to severely weaken Christianity's hold on Europe. Or as others have said, just do a Years of Rice and Salt and kill everybody.

 

[Isfendil]

ASB is magic, not stuff you don't like or think is possible.


But I do admit the timeline makes this tough. Perhaps a Muslim Spain that becomes a major colonizing/sea power? Still not easy, but a start.

I am very interested in a Muslim Ireland, but short of an Anthrax plague leaving it open to be colonized like in TYORAS I seriously think that it's impossible. I mean, there isn't even a reason or a good launching point for Muslims to launch raids to Ireland. Missionaries might go there but whether they'd get any headway is not something I'd hedge my bets on either.

Also, sidenote: the Magic part of ASB isn't even in the main title, and evolutionary/geologic PODs as well as stuff that is so utterly unlikely it is preposterous are often swept under its wing.

 

[Youngmarshall]

Alright then- conquest. Sounds simple enough. So when and how might an Islamic expansion into Ireland have the greatest chance of enduring success?

Conquest would of course automatically lead to a majority muslim irish people. We know this because of the way being ruled for 400 years by a power that actively discriminated against catholics led to the irish embracing anglicism.

 

[Isfendil]

Conquest would of course automatically lead to a majority muslim irish people. We know this because of the way being ruled for 400 years by a power that actively discriminated against catholics led to the irish embracing anglicism.

^^^ Good jibe.

Furthermore, need I remind you all of the unfortunate case of Spain? Or India for that matter?

 

[ruth]

Here's one—the Norse haven't yet adopted Christianity, but if Islam spreads through Russia, they could beat Christianity to the punch in Scandinavia, and result in Muslim Vikings establishing a syncretic Norse-Gaelic kingdom on Irish shores. And if it survives long enough for the religion to stick...

 

[Isfendil]

In short, the only way you get Muslim Ireland is if you get Muslim Western/Central Europe, which is going to be difficult, if not on conquest front than on the conversion front (jizyah is bound to cause rebellions, like in India).

Actually, I know who to ask about this: @John7755 يوحنا knows more than me about the details of the Early Khilafats, I think.

 

[ben0628]

Conquest is possible. Barbary pirates likes to attack Ireland for a good part of history. All it takes is for one power hungry pirate who goes one step further.

As for mass conversion, no. Ireland was introduced to Christianity pretty early (yay St. Patrick) and eventually a Christian nation would take back the island.

I suggest a more modern pod. Have a more devastating potato famine followed by the British putting more of an effort colonizing North Africa and the Middle East, leading to a large Muslim immigrant population that moves to the island.

 

[Youngmarshall]

Conquest is possible. Barbary pirates likes to attack Ireland for a good part of history. All it takes is for one power hungry pirate who goes one step further.

Ireland is not that easy to conquer.