AHC: Independent Alaska

Anywhere between 1799 A.D. and present day try to create an independent Alaska and tell me, how they become independent, what system of government they have, what kind of culture they have, what they are like present day, etc, etc.
 
Nonsense it was destined to be a state of Mexico. Unless they lose the Great Northern War....

Oops. Wrong dimension. :p

In all honesty, I just don't see it happening. Unless you can get a big permanent population there.
 
What? California was never independent. Well not really.
I think Marshal Duan was referring to the California Gold Rush.

I agree with the earlier posters, you need a larger population in Alaska to sustain independence, and there's no way it's going to be independent if its after industrialization, and oil is needed.
 
Have the Russians claim and organize (not necessarily colonize, just put in leaders for the colonists) more of the West coast. Have the Russians control down to about Seattle and exert just enough control to make the British and Americans wary. The settlers would be used to limited control from Russia and no control from the other powers.
During the Crimean War to avoid British attack, they throw out the government and set up their own. They allow the US and Britain favourable access to their ports and gently play the two powers off each other to keep themselves free. "We could join, but the British/Americans might get angry."
 
I think Marshal Duan was referring to the California Gold Rush.

I agree with the earlier posters, you need a larger population in Alaska to sustain independence, and there's no way it's going to be independent if its after industrialization, and oil is needed.
What if it became a penal colony for political dissidents it gives them a reason to rebel and this would increase the population coupled with an early gold rush would give a high enough population to sustain itself for long period of time.
 
Assume that Russia holds onto it through 1895. Assume also that they managed to snatch all of the gold part of the Klondike (Dawson City, so a little east). And over this time, Russian settlers have continued trickling in. Now, have the Gold Rush go as planned, with a huge influx of American and Canadian gold seekers, but with men from Latin America and Western Europe represented as well. Now, an eclectic mix of people occupies a (temporarily) wealthy province at the edges of the Russian Empire.

Naturally, the foreigners won't be happy living under Russian dominion. But the heavy Russian presence and the balance of Americans and Canadians prevents one country or the other from annexing Alaska (as does, to a lesser extant, the threat of war with Russia). And so the settler declare an independent Republic, which they are able to hold with minimal resistance from Russia.

And so, for the next seventy years ago, Alaska relies on maritime trade to keep it economically viable. And then oil is discovered.
 

Warsie

Banned
Russia does not sell Alaska, russian revolution happens, anti-bolshevists flee to alaska and hold it analogous to Taiwan/mainland china. Maybe they vote to join canada or whatnot (ukrainians made up/do make up a large canadian population)
 
Assume that Russia holds onto it through 1895. Assume also that they managed to snatch all of the gold part of the Klondike (Dawson City, so a little east). And over this time, Russian settlers have continued trickling in. Now, have the Gold Rush go as planned, with a huge influx of American and Canadian gold seekers, but with men from Latin America and Western Europe represented as well. Now, an eclectic mix of people occupies a (temporarily) wealthy province at the edges of the Russian Empire.

Naturally, the foreigners won't be happy living under Russian dominion. But the heavy Russian presence and the balance of Americans and Canadians prevents one country or the other from annexing Alaska (as does, to a lesser extant, the threat of war with Russia). And so the settler declare an independent Republic, which they are able to hold with minimal resistance from Russia.

And so, for the next seventy years ago, Alaska relies on maritime trade to keep it economically viable. And then oil is discovered.

This. You don't even need diverse settlers. If Canadian annexation is on the cards, and it threatens a world war between Russia and the British Empire, an independent state might be the compromise.
 
OK assume Russia holds on to Alaska through 1895 and on. What if America joins japan against Russia in 1905, and siezes Alaska. And some in a peace treaty, they agree to make it a nuetral state, unlikely. i think USA would sieze it, or maybe Canada siezes it first. After 1905 Russia would be pretty powerless to stop Canada or USA siezingit.

If Canada siezes it i wonder if that affects World War 1.
 
Maybe it would be possible to position more Russians there and then still have the Tsar sell of the huge chunk of North America, but to Britain rather than the United States. Incorporated as part of Canada, Alaska's Russian majority later on leads a Quebec Independence-style movement and after a successful referendum is made independent?
 
OK assume Russia holds on to Alaska through 1895 and on. What if America joins japan against Russia in 1905, and siezes Alaska.

"Mr. President, the Russians and Japanese are fighting."

"I've always wanted to hunt bears! TO KODIAK AND BEYOND! :D"

Outside that imagery, I'm not seeing why the Americans would want the ice box.

And some in a peace treaty, they agree to make it a nuetral state, unlikely. i think USA would sieze it, or maybe Canada siezes it first.

Why would the Americans bother to grab said ice box, and then let it go? The Canadians' foreign policy was set by Westminster till after the First World War... They wouldn't be doing much of anything unless given a green light by the British.

After 1905 Russia would be pretty powerless to stop Canada or USA siezingit.

As this chain of thought is reliant upon the Russo-Japanese war, Russia wouldn't be doing anything for Alaska.

If Canada siezes it i wonder if that affects World War 1.

Bear calvary, obviously. ;)
 
Alaska must have been worth something, what about Gold. 1905, Alaska still part of Russian Empire, Russian defeat, settlers rebel, Canada invades to grab the Gold and support the settlers. :cool:
 
Maybe it would be possible to position more Russians there and then still have the Tsar sell of the huge chunk of North America

As already mentioned, having the Klondike would help Alaska's population. If that population boom lasts is a different problem.

but to Britain rather than the United States.

The Russians wouldn't be doing this, they were colonial rivals with the British, remember. If Alaska suddenly became more worthwhile for the Russians or they at least thought so, they'd be keeping it or follow OTL and sell it the Americans. They may have a change of heart about the British if the sale was tried during the Triple Entente though.

Incorporated as part of Canada, Alaska's Russian majority later on leads a Quebec Independence-style movement and after a successful referendum is made independent?

I kinda doubt Alaska would be a Russian majority, unless it was quiet under populated, which is against what's been worked out so far. Having Alaska more populated means Anglos, though I could see a small Russian political party that focused on Alaskan elections. :)
 
The Russians wouldn't be doing this, they were colonial rivals with the British, remember. If Alaska suddenly became more worthwhile for the Russians or they at least thought so, they'd be keeping it or follow OTL and sell it the Americans.

Or give it independence with the US and Russia guaranteeing its neutrality.

I kinda doubt Alaska would be a Russian majority, unless it was quiet under populated, which is against what's been worked out so far. Having Alaska more populated means Anglos, though I could see a small Russian political party that focused on Alaskan elections. :)

Agreed.
 
Alaska must have been worth something, what about Gold. 1905, Alaska still part of Russian Empire, Russian defeat, settlers rebel, Canada invades to grab the Gold and support the settlers. :cool:

Why didn't the Japanese just grab Taiwan after the Guomindang lost the Chinese civil war? (Rhetorical question) I mean, it was their jewel for awhile and the GMD would be weak. Because that would greatly upset the Communists, and a potential war. Ignoring the fact the Americans would be far from happy either. :rolleyes:

If by gold you mean the Klondike, the Rush was pretty much dead by 1899. I said the Canadians were still dependent upon the British for foriegn intiatives, if anything were to be done, it would have to be okay'd by the Brits.
 
Or give it independence with the US and Russia guaranteeing its neutrality.

That could work, but the ITTL's wonderous attraction to Alaska would have to be dead by then. However, with the first World War and the Russian Civil war, I could see the British/Canadians and Americans supporting an indepedent Alaska.
 
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