AHC: Holy Roman Emperor becomes Pope, or vice versa

Thats the point. There was no real Roman nobility. The plan was more or less to gather the richest and therefore most powerful families living in rome together with some langobards and have them proclaim him emperor. Benefits: The people who gave you the title dont have actual pover to take it away from you and you and you sucessor never will have to worry about it anymore. The pope on the ther hand showed what a little shit he and more importantly his successors could be

It took quite a while for the popes to be capable of really influencing things the 11th century and beyond.

Riain: Your (and my) favorite Komnenoi emperor comes to mind.

I dunno about the first in honour/first in rules, but I could see that - it seems very appropriate for how the Byzantines treated the issue.
 
Ahh, Johnny K, one seriously devout arse kicker but he wasn't the only one. Charlemange made sure church music was at the highest standard by sending out agents to enforce his wishes with regards to music. This church music loving Charlemagne was the same bloke who destroyed the formidable Avars as a nation in battle.
 
Ahh, Johnny K, one seriously devout arse kicker but he wasn't the only one. Charlemange made sure church music was at the highest standard by sending out agents to enforce his wishes with regards to music. This church music loving Charlemagne was the same bloke who destroyed the formidable Avars as a nation in battle.

I knew there was a reason I didn't entirely despise Charlemagne, despite him being a quasi-literate barbarian wannabe usurper.

Although now I'm imagining how he'd react to this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlemagne:_By_the_Sword_and_the_Cross

But that aside, it seems to have been something some rulers were up to, and others not so much - I mean, Henry V (of England) was pious, but not in this company.

And his son was just a pious wuss.
 
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The problem is that while the Album and Christopher Lee are awesome it is historically in accurate. By most accounts Charlemagne had a very high pitch voice.

I think Charlemagne would be able to forgive that everyone still prefers to think he was a manly man. :D

Looking at the real question of the thread more seriously:

http://www.heraldica.org/topics/national/hre.htm#Qualifications

It seems that being a member of the clergy is not possible, though I'm not 100% sure on that page's sources or when that was determined from.
 

Deleted member 43582

I think Charlemagne would be able to forgive that everyone still prefers to think he was a manly man. :D

Looking at the real question of the thread more seriously:

http://www.heraldica.org/topics/national/hre.htm#Qualifications

It seems that being a member of the clergy is not possible, though I'm not 100% sure on that page's sources or when that was determined from.
Buuuut it seems that a non Catholic is possible. Therefore we have to somehow get a Greek or Russian family on the throne and have them STAY there. This would lead to them establishing an orthodox relationship with the papacy.
 
Buuuut it seems that a non Catholic is possible. Therefore we have to somehow get a Greek or Russian family on the throne and have them STAY there. This would lead to them establishing an orthodox relationship with the papacy.

"The Church is a department of the State." is not the same as the Emperor-Pope or Pope-Emperor, though.

And frankly, I can't see an Orthodox Emperor of the HRE being better able to make that work than the Catholic emperors who tried to make imperial authority in the West equal to that in the East.
 

Deleted member 43582

"The Church is a department of the State." is not the same as the Emperor-Pope or Pope-Emperor, though.

And frankly, I can't see an Orthodox Emperor of the HRE being better able to make that work than the Catholic emperors who tried to make imperial authority in the West equal to that in the East.
1. Yes but it is the closest that we will ever get.

2. Well he might have more support from the east since he is not a german-catholic "usurper".
 
1. Yes but it is the closest that we will ever get.

2. Well he might have more support from the east since he is not a german-catholic "usurper".

1: Probably.

2: Which really doesn't mean anything at all in terms of whether or not the Emperor can exercise even half the authority desired.

Conrad III and Manuel I were on good terms, didn't allow Conrad to deal with the problems of being emperor.

Or Frederick II and John III.
 
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