Starting from 476 AD (The fall of the Western Roman Empire), make another Germannic tribe other than the Franks conquer Europe. Bonus points if it is one of the lesser known Germannic people, such as the Rugii or Alemanni.
AHC: Have another Germannic tribe dominate Europe
- Thread starter FLAYvian1310
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- franks goths middle ages saxons
The Franks don't dominated Europe, they barely dominated Nothern France and the Benelux and some territories in both banks of the Rhine.
Easy. Justinian chokes on a chicken bone and his successor abandons any plans to reconquer the West. The Ostrogoths, assuming that they have someone half as competent as Theodoric, are in a great position to dominate western Europe.
Carter I'm Yog
Banned
To make some sort of pecking order.
Contenders (easy difficulty): Ostrogoths, Visigoths, United Gothic Empire
Contenders (medium difficulty): Vandals, Burgundians, Gepids, Suebi
Contenders (high difficulty): Probably everybody else
Contenders (easy difficulty): Ostrogoths, Visigoths, United Gothic Empire
Contenders (medium difficulty): Vandals, Burgundians, Gepids, Suebi
Contenders (high difficulty): Probably everybody else
Starting from 476, having someone else reach the same position the Franks reached OTL....
So far as how much we need to change things for them to do this, I mean.
Were the Vandals particularly interested in Europe at this point, or more in (formerly Roman) Africa?
So far as how much we need to change things for them to do this, I mean.
I think there may have been some interest, but they would have been mainly focused on Africa at that point. I could see them at least attempting to take over part of Hispania and/or Italy if built up enough, provided they don't get absorbed by the Byzantines first.
As for how much you need to change, go wild. As long as it is still somewhat plausible, it doesn't matter. All thats needed is to replace the Franks as Western Europe's top power, does not matter how.
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Sicily seems likely at least, if they can hold it. Hispania would definitely be interesting.
Yeah, it's definitely easiest to imagine that if Europe weren't Frankish, it would be Gothic. I'm already doing a TL that is essentially this. It would be interesting to see how over Germannic tribes rise to the same dominance that the Goths had in the Late 5th Century- Early 6th Century and the Franks had in much of the Early Middle Ages.
Carter I'm Yog
Banned
I could see them going for Italy, southern France and the eastern Spanish seaboard for pirating bases. I'll leave it to people to decide if this counts as "dominating Europe", though.
If you can think of a scenario where they would be the leading power of Europe, then absolutely.
Dominant enough that Arabs, eastern Roman’s etc often collectively referred to Western Europeans as franks
The Franks seemed to be the only one that had enough population to become "representative" of Latin Europe. Which makes sense because the Goths and Burgundii were descended from quasi-refugee/mercenary types while the Franks were locals who expanded. Perhaps the Alemanni are the best alternative because they fulfill many of the same criteria as the Franks. Indeed they ended up giving their name to Germany (in some Romance languages)
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Alcsentre Calanice
Gone Fishin'
Little nitpick: Calling Germans Alemans is mostly a French/Romance thing to do.
We Germans call ourselves "Deutsch" (stemming from an Old High German adjective meaning "of the people"), which gave "Tedesco" in Italian and "Dutch" in English.
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Perhaps the Saxons settle Normandy, destroy the Franks, and then invade England and Ireland?
I wouldn't think in those terms, we actually have no idea how many Goths or Franks actually moved around and claims like this remain just guesses.
I mean not only were we German-Roman Emperors but also some of our men became the dominant power in the entire world after they started migrating to an island...
:^)