AHC: Hallucinogens available in WW2?

Curiousone

Banned
So in modern warfare Psychedelic chemicals are part of the potential armory of combatants. Case in point: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3-quinuclidinyl_benzilate or 'BZ'.

These have all essentially been developed after WW2, the interest came after the invention of LSD in 1938 & accidental self-dosage by the inventor, introduction of knowledge about their importance to the medical profession.

There are other chemicals which have identical (to the subject) effects to LSD existing in nature however, discovery of their importance could well have been up to individual encounters.

One example, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychoactive_cacti has been traditionally favoured by Native Americans.

The scenario that occurred to me about how it might be used goes along lines such as:

An American veteran of the Great War returns with his nerves wrecked from the combat. He hits the bottle, ends up as a drifter. On his down & out travels he comes across a user of Psychedelics in the Mid-West. He doesn't understand the experience at first & takes it as a religious one. Thankfully by chance it's a good trip & our young man receives a therapeutic effect. He ditches the bottle & is convinced of the need for peace, that all men are brothers.

Piecing his life back together he gathers a moderate amount of resources by the time the Great Depression strikes. Seeing Europe re-arm he feels he's been given the religious experience for a reason, that he must share it with the world. Hiring a Chemist, he synthesizes an amount of the material (not illegal at the time) & seeks out an old comrade from the trenches that stayed in the military for advice on a practical battlefield dispersal method. Finding no audience in the U.S he travels to Britain in the late-30's, speaks of a way of fighting war without generating casualties, asks to conduct a demonstration. It's begrudgingly permitted, the political situation is getting worse & the generals don't want to be caught off guard by new technologies.

Some 'volunteers' are handed out drinks & set some tasks in a practice field.
The results are thus (actual video of British tests of LSD on soldiers):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SX7m4fqTLKU

The officers are astounded. A way of avoiding the horror & tragedy of the great war, a new humane method of waging war has appeared. Classified reports are passed up the line.

One comes across the desk of Churchill. He asks if it can be tied into a strategic bombing theories.

Speculate/fiddle with it if you need to for it to be plausible for you from here (for anyone who thinks it's too far out to be tried, consider the Bat Bomb, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAv8G8jfuGQ):
 

Cook

Banned
Ergot. It is a fungi that produces a natural halucinagen similar in effects to LSD. Ergot poisoning from eating Rye bread made from Ergot contaminated grain was so common in the middle ages in Europe that a religious order - the Brothers of Saint Anthony - was devoted to treating the infected. It became known as Saint Anthony's Fire.
 

katchen

Banned
ergotism--a war crime

Ergot. It is a fungi that produces a natural halucinagen similar in effects to LSD. Ergot poisoning from eating Rye bread made from Ergot contaminated grain was so common in the middle ages in Europe that a religious order - the Brothers of Saint Anthony - was devoted to treating the infected. It became known as Saint Anthony's Fire.
Ergot is a bit more than a hallucinogen, I'm afraid. Check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ergotism . There are ergot derivatives that can induce amongst other things, dry gangrene. While I admit, something like an epidemic of dry gangrene would leave many enemy hors de combat, spreading ergot, which is a wheat and rye fungus, would also affect the civilian populations of places like France and Poland. Don't be too surprised, once it gets out that the Allies did this, if France and Italy go Communist with a vengeance after WWII and demand that Congress impeach President Truman, if he approved this measure or continued this measure and send him to Nuremberg to stand trial in the dock for war crimes alongside the accused Nazis. Because ever since WWI, the US has been saying that biological warfare is just as bad as germ warfare.
So find a different hallucinogenic agent. Ergot is too lethal and too indiscriminate.
 

Tovarich

Banned
Don't be too surprised, once it gets out that the Allies did this, if France and Italy go Communist with a vengeance after WWII and demand that Congress impeach President Truman, if he approved this measure or continued this measure and send him to Nuremberg to stand trial in the dock for war crimes alongside the accused Nazis.
They could demand all they want, it wouldn't happen though.
A POTUS could OK sytematic rape as a war strategy, and they still wouldn't hand him over to any International Court.
Maybe impeachment and trial within the US (at least I'd hope so!)

Katchen said:
Because ever since WWI, the US has been saying that biological warfare is just as bad as germ warfare.
So find a different hallucinogenic agent. Ergot is too lethal and too indiscriminate.
That didn't stop the real US biological weapons programme which existed for decades.
 

katchen

Banned
Put it this way, Tovarich. No US President in the dock. No NATO, except for the UK and Franco's Spain and Salazar's Portugal.
 

Tovarich

Banned
Put it this way, Tovarich. No US President in the dock. No NATO, except for the UK and Franco's Spain and Salazar's Portugal.

From a US perspective, the whole point of NATO was to ensure any fighting with the USSR remained an entire ocean away from CONUS, and those three other members would be plenty to achieve that.

And even if it meant no NATO full stop, they still wouldn't hand a POTUS over for trial, not going to happen.
 
I can very much see the UK preparing a weaponised Ergot for some sort of Operation Vegetarian type scenario. It could make a interesting (if grim) timeline:

*German attempts the unmentionable sea mammal. Its forces are destroyed, partly due to the use by the British of gas on the beaches.
*Germany retaliates by dropping gas over British military sites in Southern England. Some of the gas is accidentally dropped on southern cities like Dover.
*Bomber Command drops gas on German cities in retaliation.
*Germany starts mass bombing London with VX etc.
*The UK drops anthrax laced linseed cakes, weaponised Ergot and various Hallucinogens over Germany and German cities.
*Barbarossa doesn't go nearly as well with much of the German heartland increasingly devastated (whether this means the Soviets reach the Rhine and the war finishes much earlier I don't know).
*In response to the liberal use of WMDs during the war the UK demands its dues re: the Manhattan project come the end of the war, whether it gets them or not could see a fracture in the Anglo-American post war relationship.
*The end result is a devastated Europe and the UK. With most likely a communist (if not Warsaw pact) Western Europe.

EDIT: The sea mammal is probably too cliche a POD, I bet someone could come up with a better one easily.
 
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