AHC: Fewest Countries Possible

With a POD(s) no earlier than 1900/01/01 what is the smallest number if countries that could exist by 2016/01/01?

Currently there are almost 200 nations on Earth. Can you get it down to 100 or even less?

Big ways I see is unified India, strong Ottoman Empire, USSR equivalent, dominant China, no independent Ireland and other Isles.

Is there a way to eliminate microstates? Monaco, etc.

There's the Caribbean and Africa too but I don't know enough about those places to suggest reasonable conglomeration, perhaps all of French Africa is left as a single nation or stays with France?

A lot of tiny countries on mainland central America too
 
I could see if the colonial empires are able to stay in power.

United Kingdom and the British Empire evolves into a united Commonwealth. Countries are self-governing with a ruling Commonwealth government.

Possibly France integrates Algeria and Tunisa fully and the rest and made into self-governing parts of a French Republic and/or Empire.

Get rid of US meddling and Panama stays with Columbia. The central American states could go independent with Mexico as part of the Mexican Empire or the United States of Central America manages to survive.

The European micro-states are difficult in the way that no one is really bothered with annexing them. You would need the micro state populations to want to join or stay with their larger neighbors to not be independent.
 
Since you haven't ruled out world government or nuclear war :p.

One UN/US/Nato descendant ruling (most of) the world after a 1950s nuclear war. (some small insignificant rebellious groups are holding out but most of the world thinks that a single world government is the only sure way to prevent WWIV)
 
Well a federalised EU would drop the count down about 30 or so. Get an East African federation up and running. Have the USSR survive in some form. A united Korea. Unifed Indian subcontinent. Some sort of Arab Republic going. A Maghreb Union might be doable? An EU inspired union thingy in the Sahel could possibly work. Some with Central America. Have the West Indies Federation survive (or join Canada). Singapore stays with Malaysia? Brunei joins?
 

Saphroneth

Banned
As of 1900, here's the list of sovereign nations and their earliest antecedents (via The Internet)




1. Iran 529BC
2. China 221 BC
3. Ethiopia AD c150
4. Japan c300
5. France 843
6. UK 927
7. Denmark c960
8. Sweden c1000
9. Portugal 1109
10. Austria 1156
11. Andorra 1278
12. Switzerland 1 Aug 1291
13. Monaco 8 Jan 1297
14. Turkey c1350
15. Thailand c1420
16. Spain 1479
17. Netherlands 1581
18. San Marino 1631
19. Bhutan c1650
20. Afghanistan 1747
21. Oman 1749
22. Kuwait 1756
23. Nepal c1770
24. USA 4 Jul 1776
25. Haiti 1 Jan 1804
26. Liechtenstein Aug 1806
27. Chile 18 Sep 1810
28. Paraguay 14 May 1811
29. Norway 14 Aug 1814
30. Luxembourg 9 Jun 1815
31. Argentina 9 Jul 1816
32. Colombia 17 Dec 1819
33. Peru 28 Jul 1821
34. Mexico 24 Aug 1821
35. Brazil 7 Sep 1822
36. Bolivia 6 Aug 1825
37. Uruguay 25 Aug 1825
38. Greece 3 Feb 1830
39. Ecuador 11 May 1830
40. Venezuela 11 May 1830
41. Belgium 21 Jul 1831
42. Costa Rica 1838-9
43. Guatemala 1838-9
44. Honduras 1838-9
45. Nicaragua 1838-9
46. El Salvador 1838-9
47. Dominican Republic Apr 1844
48. Liberia 26 Jul 1847
49. Italy 18 Feb 1861
50. Hungary 29 May 1867
51. Canada 1 Jul 1867
52. Germany 18 Jan 1871
53. Romania 13 Jul 1878



So there's leeway for nearly another fifty to form and still fulfil the challenge.

I'm thinking...

No Great War, no splintering of the Central/Eastern European powers (instead an evolution towards federalism or devolved powers). Let's say that Problems In Europe cause another dozen.

Ditto for the Colonial Empires. Slow process of forming Dominions or otherwise large colonial groups, and have them be big individual chunks. You could form maybe thirty and stay fairly manageable.

And, finally, consolidate Central America. That should give you a buffer.
 
1) British Imperial Federation
2) French Empire
3) GroßDeutches Reich (also called Mitteleuropa)
4) Russian Empire
5) Ottoman Empire
6) US
7) China
8) Japan
9) North European Federation (Benelux and Scandinavia)
10) Latin Alliance (Spain, Portugal, Italy)
------
The above 10 control all of Eurasia, Africa and Oceania except for
11) Persia
12) Afghanistan
13) Ethiopia
---
14) Mexico
15) Brazil
16) Argentina
17) Chile
18) Nueva Bolivaria (Peru, Ecuador, Venezuala, Colombia)

7 more small American nations Probably including Haiti Cuba and some number of Central American nations. The other islands and nations having been absorbed by stronger neighbours.

Grand Total? 25
 
- Surviving Ottoman Empire
- Successor of Imperial Russia keeps same territories which Imperial Russia had.
- Panama joins to United States.
- Lesser decolonialisation.
- India includes Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal, Bhutan, Sri Lanka and Maldives.
- No independent Papal State.
- United Scandinavia.
- Western Indian Federation survivies.
- Brunei and Singapore joins to Malaysia.
- Mongolia remain as part of China.
- United Korea.
 
The Cuban Missile Crisis gets out of hand. NATO and the Warsaw Pact nuke each other into the stone age. In the aftermath of the massive environmental collapse the entire human race is extinct. There are no more countries left.
 
Human extinction is almost impossible on the height of the nuclear arsenals,much less the cuban crisis.
 
In Latin America you could have a surviving Gran Colombia (Colombia, Venezuela, Ecuador, Panama), Peru-Bolivia and a Platinean country (Argentina, Uruguay and Paraguay) and a guayana state or something like that (the UK takes over all Guayana?). I think that Chile can't really join any of these. In Central America have the United States of Central America surviving. In the Caribbe you can have Gran Colombia annexing a few islands (Dominican asked to join, so others could as well).
 
If you could get a Federal EU going shortly after the Second World war, and its economy experiences a strong boom as most post war Western European states did for the next decade or two, maybe that becomes the inspiration for similar states forming across the world, especially in Africa and Asia as they become decolonized. That could drop the numbers pretty significantly.
 
Here is how I would do it (Not sure if it can be done under the same timeline though and I still fell further consolidations are possible with the right PODs):

  • The United States eventually controls the entity of both North America and the Caribbean as well as maybe Guiana and Gran Columbia as well.
  • Argentina annexes Uruguay, Paraguay and Chile
  • Peru-Bolivia Confederation survives.
  • The so called "Greater South Africa" concept comes to life with the union of OTL South Africa, Botswana, Swaziland, Lesotho, Namibia, Zimbabwe, Zambia, Angola, Mozambique and Katanga.
  • The East African Federation becomes a reality and includes Kenya, Uganda, Tanzania, Rwanda, Burundi and South Sudan.
I will think of more ideas later.
 

Saphroneth

Banned
But Singapore was not an independent sovereign nation in 1900. It's only counting the ones which existed as independent nations in 1900.

Interesting list. Where did you find it?

One notable exclusion would be Morocco. 1666 may be a good date for it.
On The Internet. The list was indexed to post-1900 some time, I think... possibly 1976!

Fair point about Morocco. I think it's probably counted as part of France/Spain because it was absorbed between 1900 and the index date - and what's listed is "date of sovereignty", ie the time the modern nation became independent most recently.


http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=390980
Here it is.
 
Really excited to hear all your idea guys, from one world government to blobs galore. It is really shocking to hear only 50 or so nations existed 120 years ago that's crazy.

Can't comment in any more detail at the moment but keep them coming I am reading every post
 
The Cuban Missile Crisis gets out of hand. NATO and the Warsaw Pact nuke each other into the stone age. In the aftermath of the massive environmental collapse the entire human race is extinct. There are no more countries left.

During Cuban Missile Crisis there wasn't nearly enough nuclear weapons to wipe both sides out. Both sides would devastate badly but not anything collapsing of civilisation. Better changes for this would be on 1980's and even then you don't get extinction of human kind.

In Latin America you could have a surviving Gran Colombia (Colombia, Venezuela, Ecuador, Panama), Peru-Bolivia and a Platinean country (Argentina, Uruguay and Paraguay) and a guayana state or something like that (the UK takes over all Guayana?). I think that Chile can't really join any of these. In Central America have the United States of Central America surviving. In the Caribbe you can have Gran Colombia annexing a few islands (Dominican asked to join, so others could as well).

POD is after 1900 so you can't have surviving of Grand Colombia.
 
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