AHC:Christian Ottoman Empire

Is there a POD that can make the Ottoman Empire Christian (it doesn't have to be called the Ottoman Empire)
 
Yea the difficulty is that if the Ottomans were Christian then they would just be the Byzantines. They'd probably have secured the throne through marriage long before 1453. It would be a new Turkish dynasty, not a new empire.

I don't see any feasible way to turn the Ottoman Empire Christian after its founding without just destroying it.
 
Osman I had a powerful general who was Greek and didn't convert to Islam until years after joining Osman's service. Michael the Beardless, they called him. He was likely a Roman governor who surrendered or defected. His descendants, the Mihaloğlu, were among the three most important aristocratic dynasties in the very early Ottoman state. The other two were the Evrenosoğlu and the Turahanoğlu. The Evrenosoğlu were founded by a man named Evrenos, who also appears to be European (at the very least, his name is neither Turkish nor Persian) and whose father was called the "Frank." The Turahanoğlu were probably Turks, but they appear pretty late in our sources.

Indeed, some early reports from Venetians suggest that the Ottomans were just the biggest of these noble dynasties early on. Supposedly, the four bandit leaders Osman I, Michael, Evrenos, and Turahan realized that they needed to unite into one kingdom to successfully beat the Byzantines, and as Osman was the bravest of them all they chose him as king. The rest was history.

Of course this isn't corroborated in Ottoman sources, which seeks to glorify and legitimize the Ottoman dynasty (hence the famous Osman's Dream) just as the Venetian source isn't really positive about the Ottomans. But we actually have discovered the tomb of Evrenos dating to 1317 where he is titled "King" in Arabic (malik), a word otherwise used exclusively for Ottoman sultans. So it's not entirely impossible that people like Michael and Evrenos had more important roles in the very early decades of the Ottoman empire than what's conventionally thought.
 
Osman I had a powerful general who was Greek and didn't convert to Islam until years after joining Osman's service. Michael the Beardless, they called him. He was likely a Roman governor who surrendered or defected. His descendants, the Mihaloğlu, were among the three most important aristocratic dynasties in the very early Ottoman state. The other two were the Evrenosoğlu and the Turahanoğlu. The Evrenosoğlu were founded by a man named Evrenos, who also appears to be European (at the very least, his name is neither Turkish nor Persian) and whose father was called the "Frank." The Turahanoğlu were probably Turks, but they appear pretty late in our sources.

Indeed, some early reports from Venetians suggest that the Ottomans were just the biggest of these noble dynasties early on. Supposedly, the four bandit leaders Osman I, Michael, Evrenos, and Turahan realized that they needed to unite into one kingdom to successfully beat the Byzantines, and as Osman was the bravest of them all they chose him as king. The rest was history.

Of course this isn't corroborated in Ottoman sources, which seeks to glorify and legitimize the Ottoman dynasty (hence the famous Osman's Dream) just as the Venetian source isn't really positive about the Ottomans. But we actually have discovered the tomb of Evrenos dating to 1317 where he is titled "King" in Arabic (malik), a word otherwise used exclusively for Ottoman sultans. So it's not entirely impossible that people like Michael and Evrenos had more important roles in the very early decades of the Ottoman empire than what's conventionally thought.

But then the issue is that with a POD that early, the result is a different beylik, like the Karamanids, may become the foundation of the Anatolian Turkic empire.
 

trajen777

Banned
Sulaymān ibn Qutalmïsh was in league with Alexius and was given the district of Nicea from Alexius. His famous statement was "when in Seljuk territory i support the sultan = when in Byzintine i support the Emperor. He was supported to over throw the Byz general who controlled Antioch, Eddessa and the surrounding areas. He was successful and then marched on Aleppo on instructions from Alexius but was defeated and killed by the Turks. He was reported to be switching with all of his forces to being a Christian at the time. If you have him just hold Nicea and Eddessa for Alexius and become Christian with his forces you would have had 75% of Anatolia under Alexius hands while he was defeating the Normans. With the Crusade you could have had the recapture of the rest of Anatolia. You need to have Sulayman live for 10 more years.
 
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