AHC: Charlemagne's Ghost

Onyx

Banned
Do not be confused of the title, the Challenge is to have the House of Karling's descendants, starting from 1066 or whenever you'd like for it too happen, become the ruling dynasty of France again (Not sure about HRE, it looks too ASB).

Now I honestly dont know much about Charlemagne, but having a Karling back on the throne would cause a war with the HRE over the title of Holy Roman Emperor right? If anyone can help me out on this, this is actually a nice little idea I had on my TL, I just know much about this era, how can the Karling House become Kings again, and the long term consequences
 
Do not be confused of the title, the Challenge is to have the House of Karling's descendants, starting from 1066 or whenever you'd like for it too happen, become the ruling dynasty of France again (Not sure about HRE, it looks too ASB).

Now I honestly dont know much about Charlemagne, but having a Karling back on the throne would cause a war with the HRE over the title of Holy Roman Emperor right? If anyone can help me out on this, this is actually a nice little idea I had on my TL, I just know much about this era, how can the Karling House become Kings again, and the long term consequences

I see someone has been playing Crusader Kings II.

Anyhow, if somehow the descendants of Charlemagne (in the male line, I presume - the Capets OTL married into the family) became kings of France, I doubt it would disrupt anything. Now, if the scion claimed to be rightfully ruler of all of Charlemagne's empire - nevermind the division among his (grand, I believe)sons, that might cause trouble - but not simply a different dyansty on the French throne.

As for long term consequences - butterflies are significant, but a Carolingian is no more likely or unlikely to do well or poorly as king of the Franks (the title used until 1190 OTL, I believe) than anyone else.
 

Onyx

Banned
I see someone has been playing Crusader Kings II.

Anyhow, if somehow the descendants of Charlemagne (in the male line, I presume - the Capets OTL married into the family) became kings of France, I doubt it would disrupt anything. Now, if the scion claimed to be rightfully ruler of all of Charlemagne's empire - nevermind the division among his (grand, I believe)sons, that might cause trouble - but not simply a different dyansty on the French throne.

As for long term consequences - butterflies are significant, but a Carolingian is no more likely or unlikely to do well or poorly as king of the Franks (the title used until 1190 OTL, I believe) than anyone else.

Hahahahahahahahahaaha, Ive been when I was kicked :rolleyes:

Anyways I would agree with what you said, I would assume there would be more Frankish encroachments though (Catalan, Italy, West Germania) in an effort for Carolignian glory
 
Hahahahahahahahahaaha, Ive been when I was kicked :rolleyes:

Anyways I would agree with what you said, I would assume there would be more Frankish encroachments though (Catalan, Italy, West Germania) in an effort for Carolignian glory

Given France's OTL policies - I can't see why.
 
I'm playing a CK2 game right now where I started as the Count of Vermandois(the last remaining Carolingeon) and have become King of France, Brittany, and Navarra and intend to conquer as far east as possible.

I was supported by the Pope and asked to take the throne from the Capets in my game, which seems fairly unrealistic but in some weird way plausible for real life.
 

Onyx

Banned
Given France's OTL policies - I can't see why.

Except this time the King will say something along the lines of restoring Carolignian glory.

I'm playing a CK2 game right now where I started as the Count of Vermandois(the last remaining Carolingeon) and have become King of France, Brittany, and Navarra and intend to conquer as far east as possible.

Being Off Topic here, but I managed to betrothe the Kings sister with a Karling, the King of course dies, and I got the whole Kingdom, figures

I was supported by the Pope and asked to take the throne from the Capets in my game, which seems fairly unrealistic but in some weird way plausible for real life.

Well he IS Charlemagnes descendant :rolleyes:
 
Except this time the King will say something along the lines of restoring Carolignian glory.

That might have been used OTL. It won't be taken any better/more seriously.

I'm not going to say this will be just like OTL - butterflies get in the way - but it depends too much on individual kings.
 
Well Im not going to have the Franks take total control of these lands, but Im just saying, just have some influence there.

They did have some influence there - and then some. Compare France's borders in the 11th century to the 18th.
 

Onyx

Banned
They did have some influence there - and then some. Compare France's borders in the 11th century to the 18th.

Yeah I know what you're saying

Anyways back on topic, this Karling King, he can't declare himself Emperor of his realm, am I right?
 

Onyx

Banned
Eeyup.

Though a Carolingian scion might try to gain the title.

Yeah the Holy Roman Emperor, is obviously the only Emperor in Western Europe to exist IIRC

I doubt that can happen, considering the entire realm of the HRE, but a branch of the Karling if you mean, a German one, probably
 
Yeah the Holy Roman Emperor, is obviously the only Emperor in Western Europe to exist IIRC

I doubt that can happen, considering the entire realm of the HRE, but a branch of the Karling if you mean, a German one, probably

Not sure why not - bribe electors, marry daughters, the usual.
 

Onyx

Banned
Not sure why not - bribe electors, marry daughters, the usual.

The usual intrigue crap :rolleyes:

What kind of long term consequences are we talking about though for France? We just butterflied 100 Years War out of the window possibly, even Richard I's campaigns.
Do you think France will advance much more devloped than that of OTL? I was wondering about this

Also, Charlemagne was French right?
 
The usual intrigue crap :rolleyes:

What kind of long term consequences are we talking about though for France? We just butterflied 100 Years War out of the window possibly, even Richard I's campaigns.
Do you think France will advance much more devloped than that of OTL? I was wondering about this

Also, Charlemagne was French right?

We just butterflied Richard out of existence. What kind of consequences depend heavily on the individual kings - they might be better than the OTL Capets, or worse.

Depends on your definition of French.
 
The usual intrigue crap :rolleyes:

What kind of long term consequences are we talking about though for France? We just butterflied 100 Years War out of the window possibly, even Richard I's campaigns.
Do you think France will advance much more devloped than that of OTL? I was wondering about this

Also, Charlemagne was French right?

Correct term is Frankish I believe.
 

Onyx

Banned
We just butterflied Richard out of existence. What kind of consequences depend heavily on the individual kings - they might be better than the OTL Capets, or worse.

Depends on your definition of French.

Well considering at there descendants past accomplishments, Im sure they would do better than Capets, Im sure they would strive to became true successors to Charlemagne

Depends on your definition of French.

Well French people... um, well... speak French... and... look France.. and, um, and... be French....

:rolleyes:

Correct term is Frankish I believe

Related to French though of course right? because some sources believe its both German and French
 
Well considering at there descendants past accomplishments, Im sure they would do better than Capets, Im sure they would strive to became true successors to Charlemagne

Striving to be true successors doesn't mean that they are up to the task, however.

Well French people... um, well... speak French... and... look France.. and, um, and... be French....

:rolleyes:
Which means what? What we think of as "French" today would probably be unrecognizable to Charlemagne, but so would any modern identity.
 

Onyx

Banned
Striving to be true successors doesn't mean that they are up to the task, however.

Which means what? What we think of as "French" today would probably be unrecognizable to Charlemagne, but so would any modern identity.

Well what you do think of Charlemagne? Do you think he was a descendant of French people or from a whole different culture?
 
Well what you do think of Charlemagne? Do you think he was a descendant of French people or from a whole different culture?

I think referring to "French" culture in his day is anachronistic, but he fits "French" as well as "German".
 
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