AHC: An Ottoman Colonial Empire

Yataghan

Banned
Peter had a great deal of trouble doing so. This isn't a matter of a different firm's design, this is more equivalent to asking someone who makes cars to make tanks or more so.

Has anyone argued the Ottoman navy would be a pushover?

porshe makes cars and tanks :)
 
Why on Earth would change their seat to North Africa?

"Because we might eventually develop colonies thousands of miles away to the point they become profitable" sounds crazy WITH hindsight.

If they had no option, ie, Constantinople is taken.
 

Gaius Julius Magnus

Gone Fishin'
If the Ottomans were to build a colonial empire it would more likley be in unexplored parts of Africa, India and Indonesia, and the Pacific. The Americas are just too far for any serious Ottoman colonial ambitions.
 
Which is preposterous as a POD and would imply that the Empire as such is destroyed so any Ottoman colonialism in the West is a no-go.

What if the OE never had Constantinople in the first place, with a surviving Byzantine Empire in Greece and OE being restricted to a distinctly Anatolian/Syrian powerbase? This would probably shift to Egypt sooner rather than later...
 
If the Ottomans were to build a colonial empire it would more likley be in unexplored parts of Africa, India and Indonesia, and the Pacific. The Americas are just too far for any serious Ottoman colonial ambitions.

IOTL Courland had colonies in the America's (and Africa), and it was just as far away and orders of magnitude smaller, weaker and less wealthy.
 
The Ottoman Turks are better off strengthening one of their vassals afar. Aceh could become an empire of its own, albeit in vassalage of the Turks, or even Malacca. The Turks don't have to control Aceh directly. They cold aid them in expanding their territories, which they would (although Brunei is still the main problem here). Another option for Aceh/Malacca would be to form an anti-Bruneian alliance that may see them gain a foothold in Luzon island. Sulu could also be a part of the Aceh or Malacca led coalition.
 

Gaius Julius Magnus

Gone Fishin'
IOTL Courland had colonies in the America's (and Africa), and it was just as far away and orders of magnitude smaller, weaker and less wealthy.

Courland's "colonies" were more or less small outposts, not on par with the colonies of Britain or Spain. Also Courland had generally freindly waters to go through while the Ottomans had some pissed-off Christians to deal with.
 
Courland's "colonies" were more or less small outposts, not on par with the colonies of Britain or Spain.

That's for the most part what the Spanish and British colonies were at the time period we're talking about, even after the colonization of the Mainlands quite a bit of the Caribbean remained outposts and places to grow stuff on a small scale until they got around to really focusing on them.


Also Courland had generally freindly waters to go through while the Ottomans had some pissed-off Christians to deal with.

If the Ottomans manage to take part or all of Morocco, either dirctly annexing it or establishing a Suzerainty with freindly leaders they would'nt have to worry about that.
 
I'm not sure about Courland's colonies or how they compare to British or Spanish colonies at this point, but I am sure that this is overextension for an overextended empire.

Except that they would, because they don't exactly own the western Mediterranean or the eastern Atlantic.

Morocco is at the end of a longish supply line for the Ottomans, its next door to the Iberians. Bad idea.
 
I'm not sure about Courland's colonies or how they compare to British or Spanish colonies at this point, but I am sure that this is overextension for an overextended empire.

Well, Courlands were smaller, but then this is all in the 1500's, before any large scale Colonization had started.


Morocco is at the end of a longish supply line for the Ottomans, its next door to the Iberians. Bad idea.

Britain and the Netherlands managed to hold major Imperial holdings thousands of miles away, having to rely almost exclusively on Naval transportation on the Open seas, the Ottomans on the other hand can send things along a land route or through the much calmer and closer Mediterranean.
 
Well, Courlands were smaller, but then this is all in the 1500's, before any large scale Colonization had started.

Right. I'm trusting you here since I don't know much on the subject.

Britain and the Netherlands managed to hold major Imperial holdings thousands of miles away, having to rely almost exclusively on Naval transportation on the Open seas, the Ottomans on the other hand can send things along a land route or through the much calmer and closer Mediterranean.

And this has what to do with the price of holding Morocco?

The Ottomans don't have command of the sea, and the land route is slower and longer than the route to take Morocco for the Spanish - who will see Ottoman Morocco as needed to be eliminated.

So issue becomes one of the Ottomans having a harder time defending it than the Spanish have attacking it.

Especially when Sicily isn't eliminated either.
 
I don't see any way for the Ottomans to have any territory in the Americas. I'm gonna say the best way would for them to invest in ports like Basra and others in the Indian Oceans then go to South East Asia and Eastern Africa
 
Another thing too: wouldn't one of the Italian merchant cities with excellent relations with the Ottoman Empire actually try to help them gain access to the spice trade? Say, Venice could offer to help improve the Ottoman navy since that's pretty much the department where the Ottomans really need help modernizing before they could go on their Indian Ocean adventures. Another thing would be for the Ottomans and the Mughals to form a better military alliance.
 
Another thing too: wouldn't one of the Italian merchant cities with excellent relations with the Ottoman Empire actually try to help them gain access to the spice trade? Say, Venice could offer to help improve the Ottoman navy since that's pretty much the department where the Ottomans really need help modernizing before they could go on their Indian Ocean adventures. Another thing would be for the Ottomans and the Mughals to form a better military alliance.

That is indeed a very Venetian move. In fact, the Venetians did support Muslim efforts to keep the Portuguese out of India for trade reasons for most of the Age of Discovery. The one caveat is that Venice did so covertly...and conveniently changed their opinion of the Turks and Egyptians once the Portuguese won. Maybe some Venetian cannons and ship-building were not out of the question, but the Ottomans would need to eat some 'humble pie' and realize how intertwined their interests were with Venice's control of European trade. Until then, the Venetians will be perfectly content with setting the Turks up to fail, only realizing how disastrous this would prove for both of their economies.
 
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