AHC: An attack on pearl Harbor during WW1

This would probably require some realignment of loyalties for Japan but would such an attack have been feasible during the WW1 period. Obviously it'd be ship based vs airplane at this point of time.
 
What's the objective for the attack? Just to draw the US into the war?

What were Japan's expansionist attitudes at the time? The early 1900's was right around the time the US found itself taking possession of regions in the east asian sphere.
 
This would probably require some realignment of loyalties for Japan but would such an attack have been feasible during the WW1 period. Obviously it'd be ship based vs airplane at this point of time.
Japan probably needs an ally to supply ports for the strike. That means Germany at the start of the war or Britain at any time.
 

Deleted member 9338

It could happen, German cruiser enters Pearl Harbor looking for the latest newspapers, this did happen. A British cruiser stops her from leaving, with the American forces launching a complaint. The rest of the German East Asia Squadron shows up and in the short fight the British cruiser is sunk and the port and area are shelled and there are casualties. American gun batteries open up and the Germans retaliate.

What do you think?
 
The only way I could see that happening was for for the German East Asia squadron to go to Hawaii to get coal and supplies.
They get neither because the Americans impounded their supply ships and are holding them in Pearl Harbor.
The Germans are desperate and attempt a steal back their supply ship and have it meet up with their fleet just outside the harbor. They steal their ship back but get intercepted by an American Destroyer leaving the harbor. Somebody fires a gun then cannons get fired, the Germans then proceeded to defend a German flagged vessel and wind up in a shooting match with the harbor defences.
 

Loghain

Banned
Jalapenose were with Allies in WWI but i love how some people ignore it so the Icky centrals powers wouldnt be assumed to be advantaged. For god sake unlike WWII WWI Wasnt caused by germany being insane.
 
Pearl harbor wasn't even deepened for larger ships during WWI. Basically it was a far away port, but hardly a navy yard like it was in 1941. Ford Island hadn't even been attached to the port yet. It didn't have anthing, not even a drydock. The Japanese would have to build everything themselves. Any damaged ships would have to return to Japan. A logistical nightmare.

i doubt there was even an airfield(for what?), but someone can correct me on that.
 
i doubt there was even an airfield(for what?), but someone can correct me on that.

For the future, man, for the future...

//one of there days I going to get this "plus quote" stuff down, instead of messing up 1/2 of them//
//this and the next post were suppposed to be one//
 
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nbcman

Donor
The US had constructed coastal defenses by 1914 to guard Pearl Harbor which would be daunting for a limited naval force to attack:

Battery Selfridge
Battery Selfridge was constructed from November 1907 to 1913 with two 12-inch M1895 guns on disappearing carriages, with a range of about 30,000 yards (27 km).[4] It was fort building 420, NRHP site 84000975, located at 21°19′5″N 157°57′9″W. It was named for Lt Thomas Etholen Selfridge (1882–1908).

Battery Jackson
Battery Jackson was constructed in 1913 was equipped with two 6-inch (152 mm) guns on disappearing carriages, with a range of about 15,000 yards (14 km).[4] It was fort building 430, about 1.1 acres (4,500 m2), state site 80-13-1601 and NRHP site 84000954, 21°19′6″N 157°57′22″W. It was named for American Civil War General Richard H. Jackson. A massive concrete air raid shelter was built in 1915.[5]

Battery Hawkins
Battery Hawkins was constructed in 1914 with two 3-inch (76 mm) guns with a range of about 6,000 yards (5.5 km).[4] It was fort building 440, NRHP site 84000928 located at 21°19′12″N 157°57′36″W, 440 Nelson Avenue. Another bunker built here was known as Hawkins annex, fort building 450, NRHP site 84000948, state site 80-13-1603. Although the smallest of the batteries, it is the easiest to access.[6] It was named for General Hamilton Smith Hawkins (1834–1910).[7]

Battery Hasbrouck
Battery Hasbrouck (sometimes misspelled as "Hasebrock") was constructed from July 1909 to 1914 and was equipped with eight 12-inch coast defense mortars, with a range of about 15,000 yards (14 km).[4] It was fort building 460 and NRHP site 84000925. It was directly east of the entrance to Pearl Harbor, designed to protect its mine field, at coordinates 21°19′30″N 157°57′40″W, covering 2.6 acres (11,000 m2). It was named for General Henry Cornelius Hasbrouck (1839–1910) son of William C. Hasbrouck.[8]

The first Army airfield didn't start construction until 1917 when the 6th Aero Squadron was deployed to Hawaii.
 
It could happen, German cruiser enters Pearl Harbor looking for the latest newspapers, this did happen. A British cruiser stops her from leaving, with the American forces launching a complaint. The rest of the German East Asia Squadron shows up and in the short fight the British cruiser is sunk and the port and area are shelled and there are casualties. American gun batteries open up and the Germans retaliate.

What do you think?
Sounds like the Brit cruiser is outside the harbor, shooting in, and they'd be the one causing damage to the port. Maybe you should have the Brit show up for the paper and the East Asia Sq trapping them there. Wouldn't think the US would be all that anxious to start a bang, either way...
 

Deleted member 9338

Sounds like the Brit cruiser is outside the harbor, shooting in, and they'd be the one causing damage to the port. Maybe you should have the Brit show up for the paper and the East Asia Sq trapping them there. Wouldn't think the US would be all that anxious to start a bang, either way...

Your sceanario is what I was trying to write, I just want the Germans causing the situation to get out of hand
 
Your sceanario is what I was trying to write, I just want the Germans causing the situation to get out of hand
Whoever's outside shooting into the port is going to be accused of being something akin to a "rabid dog" without any sense, and the guy who went out for the paper is going to get his paper, AND a medal, for getting the US in the war on their side.
 

Deleted member 9338

Whoever's outside shooting into the port is going to be accused of being something akin to a "rabid dog" without any sense, and the guy who went out for the paper is going to get his paper, AND a medal, for getting the US in the war on their side.

All I was trying to do was get a WWI Pearl Harbor as asked. FYI the Germans did send a cruiser to Hawaii to collect messages and papers IOTL
 
The only way I could see that happening was for for the German East Asia squadron to go to Hawaii to get coal and supplies.
They get neither because the Americans impounded their supply ships and are holding them in Pearl Harbor.
The Germans are desperate and attempt a steal back their supply ship and have it meet up with their fleet just outside the harbor. They steal their ship back but get intercepted by an American Destroyer leaving the harbor. Somebody fires a gun then cannons get fired, the Germans then proceeded to defend a German flagged vessel and wind up in a shooting match with the harbor defences.

We could have one of the German ships carrying a seaplane which manages to take off and bomb the harbor.
 
Your sceanario is what I was trying to write, I just want the Germans causing the situation to get out of hand

The Germans don't have enough naval power projection for them to give two marks on the state of the US Pacific Fleet. Pearl Harbor made sense for Japan because, by crippling America's ability to operate a naval force in the Pacific with minimal risk to its own naval strength, they could gain vital "breathing space" and an advantage in local, available firepower. Damaging the facilities at Pearl effectively means that, even if the US ships can be rebuilt (Which takes time, especially if the local docks, shipyards, and airports are damaged too: their capacity is needed to ship in and process the supplies needed to repair and re supply ships, after all, as well as the raw materials needed for their own recovery).

The Germans, on the other hand, aren't going to be in any better or worse of a position because of the American fleet's status, even if the Americans declaring war on them looked inevitable. After all, they don't have any commercial capacity left in the Pacific, and the Royal Navy has the High Seas Fleet bottled up.

If a Pearl Harbor happened in WW I, it would probably be caused by the British; perhaps in response to America putting heavy pressure on the UK government to loosen up the blockade (at least for neutrals) and demanding their rights as a non-belligerent power be respected. The British, beleaving that any loosening would just result in a flood of supplies being re-exported to Germany, try to preform a pre-emotive strike on American naval power using "Gunboat diplomacy": theorizing that if they can cripple American naval power enough, the silly Colonials will back off on their trade demands and not actually declare war, as they would be afraid of their vulnerability to British naval power. Granted, that's a bit of a miscalculation, but combined with a pre-emotive strike on a concentration of American forces on the Atlantic side as well I can see the Admiriality at least considering it.
 
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