AHC: An actual Wild Wild West

Something about the action of the 1895 Browning or "Potato Digger" seems quite steampunk. I wonder if this tech could have been feasible maybe 10-20 years earlier and would have been a rival and likely supplant the Gatling gun.

Would seem much easier to outfit trains or wagons with this than it would a Gatling:

I mentioned that earlier about John Brownings "Flapper" modification to a Winchester that proceeded his design of the M1895. I'd like to think that it could work on a Henry rifle or a Winchester 1866

I also have been doing more research into airship design and found out about an American named Rufus Porter. He was the founder of Scientific American magazine, though he sold it soon after founding it, and was planning ideas of steerable balloons since the early 1800s. In the 1850s he made several attempts at building airships based on his designs but he was unable to complete them due to being damaged by storms and sabotage. I imagine that if he had been more succesful it would have made a foundation for more advanted airship tech to grow from. He was already ahead of his time with his idea of using an inner frame of spruce rods in the envelope.
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I also found a link to an article about the history of airships in the 1800s that talks about Porter and other American inventors Solomon Andres and Frederick Marriot. Both of which also made great attempts at navigable airships. Both had somewhat hybrid-airship designs. Andrews could practically "sail" his airship through the sky, and Marriot powered his with an alcohol fueled engine.

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The next most interesting design was developed by a Frenchman during the Franco-Prussian war by the name of Dupuy_de_Lôme. It the feature of interst to me being a propeller powered by a crank turned by several crewmen, much like in the Hunley Submarine. It was first flown in 1872. I like the idea of imagining this form of power becoming popular, with teams of men cranking the propeller to the tune of a drum like in ancient warships with some big sweaty guy yelling "Come on! Put your backs into it!"
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I mentioned that earlier about John Brownings "Flapper" modification to a Winchester that proceeded his design of the M1895. I'd like to think that it could work on a Henry rifle or a Winchester 1866
Having man portable automatic or semi automatic weapon as early as the 1870's would be a big force multiplier. Though with the cost of even worse fowling of the barrel and visibility ruining smoke do to people still using black powder, considering how trigger happy people can be. I mean you can eventually use smokeless powder but that would have it's own issues.... We probably wouldn't be seeing weapons like the M1 garand showing up, on large scale until the turn of the century in universe. Though on the other hand there's still plenty of room for lever actions, revolvers, chain guns, bolt actions and harmonica guns.

I also have been doing more research into airship design and found out about an American named Rufus Porter. He was the founder of Scientific American magazine, though he sold it soon after founding it, and was planning ideas of steerable balloons since the early 1800s. In the 1850s he made several attempts at building airships based on his designs but he was unable to complete them due to being damaged by storms and sabotage. I imagine that if he had been more succesful it would have made a foundation for more advanted airship tech to grow from. He was already ahead of his time with his idea of using an inner frame of spruce rods in the envelope.


I also found a link to an article about the history of airships in the 1800s that talks about Porter and other American inventors Solomon Andres and Frederick Marriot. Both of which also made great attempts at navigable airships. Both had somewhat hybrid-airship designs. Andrews could practically "sail" his airship through the sky, and Marriot powered his with an alcohol fueled engine.


The next most interesting design was developed by a Frenchman during the Franco-Prussian war by the name of Dupuy_de_Lôme. It the feature of interst to me being a propeller powered by a crank turned by several crewmen, much like in the Hunley Submarine. It was first flown in 1872. I like the idea of imagining this form of power becoming popular, with teams of men cranking the propeller to the tune of a drum like in ancient warships with some big sweaty guy yelling "Come on! Put your backs into it!"
Those are some truly fascinating designs. The French design seems like the most affordable for small scale scouting or mapping out regions. While Porter's design has some real potential, especially if we mix in the idea of Doble styled steam engines being developed during the 1870's.
I also think these will be appreciated here


Awesome.
 
Having man portable automatic or semi automatic weapon as early as the 1870's would be a big force multiplier. Though with the cost of even worse fowling of the barrel and visibility ruining smoke do to people still using black powder, considering how trigger happy people can be. I mean you can eventually use smokeless powder but that would have it's own issues.... We probably wouldn't be seeing weapons like the M1 garand showing up, on large scale until the turn of the century in universe. Though on the other hand there's still plenty of room for lever actions, revolvers, chain guns, bolt actions and harmonica guns.


Those are some truly fascinating designs. The French design seems like the most affordable for small scale scouting or mapping out regions. While Porter's design has some real potential, especially if we mix in the idea of Doble styled steam engines being developed during the 1870's.

Awesome.
I still think a Winchester 1876 modified with something like Browning's gas operated system, or Maxim's recoil operated system, would be an intimidating weapon.

I have another link that details more on Rufus Porter's airship and his plans to use it as a means of transcontinental travel to California. As well as a link detailing Solomon Andrews' ship explaining how it worked by stating "Its power was a combination of gravity and Archimedes’ Principle ". I also found his 1864 patent.

There was also a Georgian man named Micajah Dyer who patented an airship design in 1874 with a rigid envelop, flapping wings, and paddle wheels under the wings. Very steampunky. There are claims he build and flew his airship design but that is a matter of debate. I even made the personal discovery of a site dedicated to Eric Flint's Ring of Fire series with a page about the Aereon.

I also should have mentioned the Schütte-Lanz_airships much earlier. They were a series of airships built between 1909 and 1917 that actually made their frames from plywood instead of aluminium alloys. Something much more achievable with late 19th century technology
 
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Having man portable automatic or semi automatic weapon as early as the 1870's would be a big force multiplier. Though with the cost of even worse fowling of the barrel and visibility ruining smoke do to people still using black powder, considering how trigger happy people can be. I mean you can eventually use smokeless powder but that would have it's own issues.... We probably wouldn't be seeing weapons like the M1 garand showing up, on large scale until the turn of the century in universe. Though on the other hand there's still plenty of room for lever actions, revolvers, chain guns, bolt actions and harmonica guns.
I can imagine seeing things like this



A Taczanka, which was a horse carriage with a machine gun attached used around the WW1 era.

I can only imagine how bloody the 1870s American Indian plains wars would have been with these.
 
I can imagine seeing things like this



A Taczanka, which was a horse carriage with a machine gun attached used around the WW1 era.

I can only imagine how bloody the 1870s American Indian plains wars would have been with these.
Let's also not forget about the Range Wars and other similar conflicts that raged across the west during the 1860's to 90's.
 
I still think a Winchester 1876 modified with something like Browning's gas operated system, or Maxim's recoil operated system, would be an intimidating weapon.
Very true. Could see something like that being favored by the cavalry... though the military doctrines of the time may have an effect on its adoption. Of course I'm hoping that something like the Browning BLR would get invented a century earlier and see use in the west.
I have another link that details more on Rufus Porter's airship and his plans to use it as a means of transcontinental travel to California. As well as a link detailing Solomon Andrews' ship explaining how it worked by stating "Its power was a combination of gravity and Archimedes’ Principle ". I also found his 1864 patent.

There was also a Georgian man named Micajah Dyer who patented an airship design in 1874 with a rigid envelop, flapping wings, and paddle wheels under the wings. Very steampunky. There are claims he build and flew his airship design but that is a matter of debate. I even made the personal discovery of a site dedicated to Eric Flint's Ring of Fire series with a page about the Aereon.

I also should have mentioned the Schütte-Lanz_airships much earlier. They were a series of airships built between 1909 and 1917 that actually made their frames from plywood instead of aluminium alloys. Something much more achievable with late 19th century technology
The wood and plywood frames definitely have potential for the earlier arrival of true airships during the 19th century. Actually with the right steam engine I could see the first transatlantic flight happening during the 19th century via airship, under the right circumstances. Maybe a wooden frame airship with gliding wings to take advantage of the wind currents & some more light weight steam engines for thrust?
 
I can imagine seeing things like this



A Taczanka, which was a horse carriage with a machine gun attached used around the WW1 era.

I can only imagine how bloody the 1870s American Indian plains wars would have been with these.
Gatling Gun Tacanka are very plausible. Just put a Gatling in the back of a wagon! That setup is even used in one of the Call of Juarez video games

Also reminds me of that not too bad, not too good, but still fun western The War Wagon!

Or that scene from the 3:10 to Yuma remake
 
Gatling Gun Tacanka are very plausible. Just put a Gatling in the back of a wagon! That setup is even used in one of the Call of Juarez video games

Also reminds me of that not too bad, not too good, but still fun western The War Wagon!

Or that scene from the 3:10 to Yuma remake
I'm sure it was possible but it would be easier with the smaller and more maneuverable machine guns of the early 20th century. A full Gatling gun was like a piece of artillery.

Going back to the Indian wars Custer could have and probably should have brought a Gatling with him to Little Big Horn he just hated lugging it around.

The Tacanka was used like modern day drive byes, quick in unload your rounds and quick out.
 
Well I just read Steampunk Soldier: The American Frontier book really enjoyed the WW1 styled Confederate Bombardier design and the land ironclad. It would make sense that the various nations would be using airships for bombing enemy targets, with their earlier emergence.
Gatling Gun Tacanka are very plausible. Just put a Gatling in the back of a wagon! That setup is even used in one of the Call of Juarez video games

Also reminds me of that not too bad, not too good, but still fun western The War Wagon!

Or that scene from the 3:10 to Yuma remake
Also let's not forget the original Red Dead Redemption...
I'm sure it was possible but it would be easier with the smaller and more maneuverable machine guns of the early 20th century. A full Gatling gun was like a piece of artillery.

Going back to the Indian wars Custer could have and probably should have brought a Gatling with him to Little Big Horn he just hated lugging it around.

The Tacanka was used like modern day drive byes, quick in unload your rounds and quick out.
I'd like to point out the Gardner gun as a potential alternative to the Gatling Gun for a 19th Tacanka. Being a hand cranked machine gun that was closer to the Maxim than the Gatling, in terms of portability and handling.
 
New York to Chicago in 12 hours, that's not far off how long it'd take to travel that distance by car now.

How long would a train from New York to Chicago take back then? I can't imagine it'd be much more than 12 hours even back then.
 
New York to Chicago in 12 hours, that's not far off how long it'd take to travel that distance by car now.

How long would a train from New York to Chicago take back then? I can't imagine it'd be much more than 12 hours even back then.
The fastest (and most expensive) train service from NY to Chicago, the "20th Century Limited", took about 20 hours and cost $50 ($650 today). Cheaper routes might take 48 hours.

 
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New York to Chicago in 12 hours, that's not far off how long it'd take to travel that distance by car now.

How long would a train from New York to Chicago take back then? I can't imagine it'd be much more than 12 hours even back then.
The fastest (and most expensive) train service from NY to Chicago, the "20th Century Limited", took about 20 hours and cost $50 ($650 today). Cheaper routes might take 48 hours.

Steam turbine locomotives were briefly flirted with in OTL as a potential means of preserving the relevance of steam power in the face of new diesel powered trains. Though admittedly they weren't that success do to technical issues... Perhaps with the earlier emergence of the Steam wagon and Doble styled steam engines the steam turbine trains could emerge a few decades earlier to a limited degree, as a natural offshot of this world's innovations. Even if they eventually get out competed by diesel powered locomotives in the long term or get replaced by nuclear powered trains.
 
Steam turbine locomotives were briefly flirted with in OTL as a potential means of preserving the relevance of steam power in the face of new diesel powered trains. Though admittedly they weren't that success do to technical issues... Perhaps with the earlier emergence of the Steam wagon and Doble styled steam engines the steam turbine trains could emerge a few decades earlier to a limited degree, as a natural offshot of this world's innovations. Even if they eventually get out competed by diesel powered locomotives in the long term or get replaced by nuclear powered trains.
Steam turbine technology could have been invented much earlier than in OTL. I met the author of The Guns Above series a few years ago and they explained how the basic principle of the steam turbine was being used to spin meat over a fireplace as far back as the 1500s in the Ottoman Empire. It is refered to as a Steam Jack, and for that reason she calls the engine in The Guns Above a Steamjack engine. Davinci also came up with his own design, as well as others by the early 1800s. I think it would be easy to convert that idea to a steam engine in the mid 1800s.

The Guns Above Mistral.jpg
 
Steam turbine technology could have been invented much earlier than in OTL. I met the author of The Guns Above series a few years ago and they explained how the basic principle of the steam turbine was being used to spin meat over a fireplace as far back as the 1500s in the Ottoman Empire. It is refered to as a Steam Jack, and for that reason she calls the engine in The Guns Above a Steamjack engine. Davinci also came up with his own design, as well as others by the early 1800s. I think it would be easy to convert that idea to a steam engine in the mid 1800s.

That would probably make trans oceanic travel easier in the 19th century. Especially if you pair it with the idea of the Seadrome, for potential stopping points between point A & B. Which would be a lot more practical if you have widespread adoption of airships yet at the same time airplane isn't widespread or very developed.

I do wonder if Radio technology could be developed and adopted a few decades earlier during the Wild West.... probably by Tesla.
 
That would probably make trans oceanic travel easier in the 19th century. Especially if you pair it with the idea of the Seadrome, for potential stopping points between point A & B. Which would be a lot more practical if you have widespread adoption of airships yet at the same time airplane isn't widespread or very developed.

I do wonder if Radio technology could be developed and adopted a few decades earlier during the Wild West.... probably by Tesla.
Someone like I K Brunel putting steam turbines into something the size of the Great Eastern (instead of his own rather cumbersome and inefficient designs) would've revolutionized transoceanic travel :)
 
Take away the riot shield and I can see this being Imperial Germany in universe.
Someone like I K Brunel putting steam turbines into something the size of the Great Eastern (instead of his own rather cumbersome and inefficient designs) would've revolutionized transoceanic travel :)
That's honestly making me think that dreadnoughts could be introduced a few decades ahead of OTL with that, alongside the revolutions in transoceanic travel.
 
Well I just read Steampunk Soldier: The American Frontier book really enjoyed the WW1 styled Confederate Bombardier design and the land ironclad. It would make sense that the various nations would be using airships for bombing enemy targets, with their earlier emergence.


Also let's not forget the original Red Dead Redemption...

I'd like to point out the Gardner gun as a potential alternative to the Gatling Gun for a 19th Tacanka. Being a hand cranked machine gun that was closer to the Maxim than the Gatling, in terms of portability and handling.
I have been trying to research details on the Gardner gun and I was wondering if you could help. Do you know the details on the differences between the different models of the Gardner in regards to weight and efficiency? I am wondering which would be best as a mobile machine gun. Or if the design could be plausibly modified further to that purpose from the OTL design. A resource I found mentions a model that I think would fit that criteria but I cannot find any further references to the model mentioned. It states "Gardner Gun Company’s two-barreled gun production was again slow and by March 2, 1886 . . . Colonel Arbustnot, British Army, indicated to Norton, if the two-barreled gun weight could be reduced to 80 pounds, the gun would be adopted. He consented to have the barrels and casing shortened. Colonel Arbustnot directed that thirty-six, two-barreled guns and twenty, five-barreled guns be changed to the new Enfield Martini ammunition in Caliber .40"

80 lbs would be a good weight for a mobile machine gun unit. I think the comment of it being in Enfield Martini .40 Caliber is a typo though because the resource I know of state that the Martini Henry was .45 Caliber and the Enfield Martini was .303 caliber
 
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