AHC: A German-American left-wing consensus

Rush Tarquin

Gone Fishin'
Okay, the challenge is to spread the 'Deutche Athen' German-American political attitude beyond the upper midwest and into a durable, national, German-American political consensus.
 

Rush Tarquin

Gone Fishin'
A good question might be - what is this about?

I don't think its about this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_School_of_Athens

so I'm flummoxed...

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

German Athens refers to the cultural environment which sprung up in Milwaukee due to the influx of German immigrants in the 19th century. It's mostly used now to refer to musical and artistic endeavours during the period, but the immigration also imported the German beer hall culture and many civic organisation sprung up. It helps to explain how Milwaukee had three Socialist mayors.

Supposedly a lot of the migrants to the area in this period were refugees from 1848.

http://www.echoworld.com/B06/B0608/B0608Milwaukee.htm
http://www.expressmilwaukee.com/blog-3038-john-gurda-on-how-the-socialists-saved-milwaukee.html
 
Do you mean a larger German-American political movement, or a non-ethnic political movement based on the ideals of the Forty-Eighters? Or just a strong Central European style Socialist party?
 

Rush Tarquin

Gone Fishin'
Do you mean a larger German-American political movement, or a non-ethnic political movement based on the ideals of the Forty-Eighters? Or just a strong Central European style Socialist party?

I'm keeping it general. German-Americans as a predominantly left-leaning ethnic bloc a la African-Americans or Jewish Americans.
 
I'm keeping it general. German-Americans as a predominantly left-leaning ethnic bloc a la African-Americans or Jewish Americans.

That's difficult then. Germans assimilate way too easily into mainstream culture compared to those groups. They don't have anything for some prejudicial media to point to and show that their different, at least nothing like religion or skin-color that can't be changed easily.

Now, it's possible that you could get something more like Italian-Americans or Irish-Americans. For some reason, German-Americans don't make as big a deal out of their heritage as other immigrant groups. You don't hear a lot of celebrities bragging about their German upbringing (well, except on Prairie Home Companion), despite their population figures being somewhat higher. I'd guess it probably has something to do with a war or two :).
 
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Deleted member 1487

That's difficult then. Germans assimilate way too easily into mainstream culture compared to those groups. They don't have anything for some prejudicial media to point to and show that their different, at least nothing like religion or skin-color that can't be changed easily.

Now, it's possible that you could get something more like Italian-Americans or Irish-Americans. For some reason, German-Americans don't make as big a deal out of their heritage as other immigrant groups. You don't hear a lot of celebrities bragging about their German upbringing (well, except on Prairie Home Companion), despite their population figures being very close. I'd guess it probably has something to do with a war or two :).

It took the world wars for them to really assimiliate. Avoid those and German-Americans will remain a more united and distinct group. The spirit of '48 'may' remain, but Germans of all political bent came over the years. I guess avoid the communist revolution in Russia and prevent the destruction of socialism in the US (and its coopting by FDR) and Germans will remain a major group in the labor movement.
 

Rush Tarquin

Gone Fishin'
@ Swan Station:

Indeed it is difficult. This challenge is intended as a real challenge, not fishing for ideas.

If you've got ideas for the three possibilities you mentioned though, I'd love to hear them.
 
@ Swan Station:

Indeed it is difficult. This challenge is intended as a real challenge, not fishing for ideas.

If you've got ideas for the three possibilities you mentioned though, I'd love to hear them.

Sorry I'm not up for this challenge, but here are a few ideas:

Pretty much what wiking said, do something to the World Wars so that there is far less anti-German sentiment in the U.S. That's the tough part.

Combine this with German-American social customs becoming fashionable in the media later in the twentieth century (like St. Patricks Day and Celtic Music did for Irish, or Italian Food and, dare I say it, Mafia movies, did for the Italians).

Alternatively, maybe focus more German immigrants into big cities, instead of rural areas. If they've got control of the infrastructure of a couple of cities larger than Milwaukee, Cincinnati and St. Louis they could form the basis of large political machines in those cities. They might have a chance over the Irish in Chicago. Of course, this probably changes the nature of German immigrants who arrive here, if they prefer to find work in the big cities over going to find farmland.

My last idea: Fighting Bob becomes President, and he brings in some Milwaukee Socialists for his administration.

Or, maybe... Debs/Seidel 1912, followed closely by a presidential assassination.
 
That's difficult then. Germans assimilate way too easily into mainstream culture compared to those groups. They don't have anything for some prejudicial media to point to and show that their different, at least nothing like religion or skin-color that can't be changed easily.

Now, it's possible that you could get something more like Italian-Americans or Irish-Americans. For some reason, German-Americans don't make as big a deal out of their heritage as other immigrant groups. You don't hear a lot of celebrities bragging about their German upbringing (well, except on Prairie Home Companion), despite their population figures being somewhat higher. I'd guess it probably has something to do with a war or two :).
Anecdotally, l've been told by various relatives and elderly teachers that in my neck of the woods, German was the lingua franca prior to the outbreak of the first world war, when the community made a deliberate effort to assimilate. I wouldn't be shocked to hear similar stories from other heavily German areas in the midwest.

If the United States had remained neutral, perhaps we wouldn't have lost the lanuage and you would see a sort of German Quebec develop in rural Illinois, Ohio, Indiana, and Wisconsin.
Something like French speakers in Louisiana, only larger as a % of the population.
 

Deleted member 1487

Anecdotally, l've been told by various relatives and elderly teachers that in my neck of the woods, German was the lingua franca prior to the outbreak of the first world war, when the community made a deliberate effort to assimilate. I wouldn't be shocked to hear similar stories from other heavily German areas in the midwest.

If the United States had remained neutral, perhaps we wouldn't have lost the lanuage and you would see a sort of German Quebec develop in rural Illinois, Ohio, Indiana, and Wisconsin.
Something like French speakers in Louisiana, only larger as a % of the population.

Supposedly there were even some communities where even 3rd and 4th generation immigrant descendants only spoke German in some neighborhoods.
 
Anecdotally, l've been told by various relatives and elderly teachers that in my neck of the woods, German was the lingua franca prior to the outbreak of the first world war, when the community made a deliberate effort to assimilate. I wouldn't be shocked to hear similar stories from other heavily German areas in the midwest.

If the United States had remained neutral, perhaps we wouldn't have lost the lanuage and you would see a sort of German Quebec develop in rural Illinois, Ohio, Indiana, and Wisconsin.
Something like French speakers in Louisiana, only larger as a % of the population.

You know, I hadn't even thought of that.

In Urban areas, immigrants definitely lost their languages within a couple of generations, but in more isolated Rural areas, they could easily hold on to them longer. The existence of big city presses in places like Milwaukee printing German newspapers helps this, and German radio stations too. If you could get rural schools to teach at least partly in German it might help too. This is easier done with private schools who have less oversight from the government, and there are a heck of a lot of German Catholics in the Midwest.

But still, changing US involvement in the world wars is what is most necessary. And then, you're probably going to end up with completely different U.S. politics in the twentieth century: a German-American voting bloc won't be the only change.
 
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