AHB: Larger United States vs Gran Colombia

[Erizium]

(I meant AHC.)
With a PoD after the Louisiana Purchase, but before the Spanish-American War, have a United States with greater power face off against a surviving Gran Colombia

Requirements: The United States must be geographically larger (Possibly by demanding more land in the Mexican-American War, or downright annexing moreof it. Purchasing Caribbean Islands, or gaining land from Canada)

:Gran Colombia, at the minimum, must have all of former Gran Colombia, at the maximum, all of South America, and Central America up to Mexico, plus a few Caribbean Islands

:A state of hostilities (official or not) must exist between the 2 countries from a certain point in history until modern day

:Both countries must have a side in this world's WW1. In their WW2, at least one of the countries should have a side.

:Mexico stays independent

:Bonus points for any ideological wars between the two.

 

[GohanLSSJ2]

(I meant AHC.)
With a PoD after the Louisiana Purchase, but before the Spanish-American War, have a United States with greater power face off against a surviving Gran Colombia

Requirements: The United States must be geographically larger (Possibly by demanding more land in the Mexican-American War, or downright annexing all of it. Purchasing Caribbean Islands, or gaining land from Canada)

:Gran Colombia, at the minimum, must have all of former Gran Colombia, at the maximum, all of South America, and Central America up to Mexico, plus a few Caribbean Islands

:A state of hostilities (official or not) must exist between the 2 countries from a certain point in history until modern day

:Both countries must have a side in this world's WW1. In their WW2, at least one of the countries should have a side.

:Bonus points for any ideological wars between the two.

So tempted to style this as an ideological war between white supremacy and Native American revindication...

 

[Erizium]

Hmmm. That could work. I guess Natives from North America relocate into Colombia because of the fairer treatment?

 

[GohanLSSJ2]

Hmmm. That could work. I guess Natives from North America relocate into Colombia because of the fairer treatment?

That can work. Even when governed by criollos there was room for Natives in society. I mean, no one spoke of eliminating them.

Also, maybe if Colombia wins, the USA has to release thr Mexican territories?

 

[Armot]

I guess Hispanic Americans needed a better planning, more communication between the different independentist leaders, a Continental Congress, and other things that were done by the USA when going independent. This may delay the start of the independentist movements until they get more prepared, but the chance was Napoleon's attack on Spain, so there's little time to develop a common goal for all Hispanic Americans.

I seriously doubt about the Natives playing a bigger rol on this, the Criollos were just as racist as Europeans and North Americans, there were patronizing and condescendent Criollos, and the outright proslavery motherf**ker ones. That's why you need a bigger a better connected community of Enlightened Criollos.

But here we have the same problems that had Spain: no room for Enlightenment because of its Catholic culture. How you can have Enlightenment in a culture that doesn't allow you to interpret your religion, where just a few people know how to read, where there is no tradition of pursue of liberty and rights for the bourgeoisie because of the dominance of the landowner elite?

And this is where Hispanic America was similar to the American South: economical dominance of the landowners (the Hacendados). But the Southener aristocracy was a fervent lover of liberty (from government for oppress slaves).

Without industrialization and the development of a urban bourgeoisie, a Gran Colombia is condemned to become what most Latin American countries were between 1850 to 1930 (approximate dates): an anarchocapitalist dystopia runned by omnipotent landowners, so you will only skip the chaotic period of the search of an identity and a goal for each now independent Latin American country between 1810 and 1850 (approximate dates).

There is a big chance for the South (the American South) to side with such an awful country as this Gran Colombia. So, the ideological conflict will be liberal (in the European sense) United States of America versus conservative (again in the European sense) Gran República de Colombia and its puppet, the Confederate States of America.

EDIT: Now that I read the first post again, in WW1: Gran Colombia will side with the Central Powers while America will side with the Entente.

 

[Lampiao]

You mean to make a country between high mountains and dense rainforest a superpower? Good luck.