AH Challenge: The Weimar Republic Survives TL

You are absolutely right that this needs to be developed further. I wonder who they'd go with the UK/Indian split? Depends on how things develop. Probably India though as the majority would look upon them as liberators. I could see a white terrorist organization or three in that region, btw.

So, let's see you write some events and we'll get them in!

It was pretty hard to see the development of specific aspects as Weimar World is largely written like a CV and three fourths of the timeline discussion deals with the first thirty years (or maybe even two thirds with the first twenty years). That split you talk of only reminds me of the New Britain timeline, but that larger home rule and a shift of power towards a bigger country within the structure becomes inevitable is out of debate for me. If you don't want the British Empire to become a Commonwealth as untight as that of OTL but want to have that devolution spirit intact, you may even think of handing over colonies to locally near dominions. The Australian Commonwealth received Papua New Guniea from the British metropole virtually after its foundation. You may do the same to most of Southern Africa as of the late 20th century, at least receiving Namibia and Rhodesia. A racially desegregated by the late 1970s.

Huh? I don't quite get where you're going with this. Could you elaborate?

ATL Japan = OTL Serbia
ATL South Korea = OTL Kosovo (or „North Albania“)
ATL North Korea = OTL Albania (or „South Albania“)


The relatively thin 1990's deal, among other things, about protests for Choson independence. Koreans of the South want to get rid of the Japanese, but reunification with the North is somehow disaccelerated due to human rights violations up there, at least in public opinion. It might seem plausible that the Americans would have forced the Japanese to grant substantial autonomy to their Korean holdings after the Pacific War if Japan really would have been allowed to keep it. I might see that at one point the people of the Choson province unilateraly declare their independence, just like Kosovo did from Serbia in OTL recently, though not with the same bloodbath.


I might even see less reluctancy from Japan to Choson recession ITTL than the reluctancy Serbia is showing to Cosovar secession IOTL, maybe because the Japanese sweared themselves to be an extremely civilized nation and want to literally save their face compared to the French who lived to see some kind of counter-secession with the French Union expelling them. And because Korea isn't the myth of a cradle of nation that Kosovo is to Serbia.


When the Choson province becomes independent, the old question of reuniting the two Koreas will be asked again. Reunification would be seen as an essentially good idea, but it's obvious that the fifty or maybe sixty years of division produced some kind of alienation which is at least as severe as that of the two Germanies IOTL, though that alienation among Koreans may not be that extreme ITTL as IOTL. And yes, this alienation IOTL also happened to the Albanian nation where Albania proper also has experienced decades of Stalinism. These parallels are absolutely deliberate.

It's as silly as OTL's North Atlantic Treaty Organization. NEA stays, I'm afraid.

The Med is a side arm of the Atlantic to me, north of Africa and therefore quite north of the Equator and any other thinkable line that could be thought of to be the dividing ling between a Northern and Southern. Even if you don't count the Arctic Ocean to be a marginal sea of the Atlantic, even having Russia in the NATO wouldn't make the name ridiculous as long as St. Petersburg remains Russian territory, though definitely being a borderline case.


BTW, as the 1960's show forms of economic co-operation among the NEA members, there might be different names for the defense pillar (the classic NEA) and the economic pillar (EEC or similar). As there already is a European Federation as of 2004 ITTL, that would match perfectly into the genuine pattern of European integration ITTL. OTL European Union has an even more incomprehensible pattern of pillars than the European Federation of Weimar World.

I don't know about this. The French still have a lot of economic ties with their former Union, and they still have significant influence in the Lowlands and Switzerland. I can see them staying out for quite some time. I would not be opposed, however, to you or anyone else writing some events moving France closer and closer to united Europe, just so long as they don't contradict already existing events (and maps), and just so long as they don't join before the end of the timeline.

PS - I've been pondering a 'Weimar World, the Next 100 Years" extension of the timeline, so you might be setting the stage for some new events for that timeline....
IIRC it's still the British and the French that rule the oil industry in Africa IOTL. Lowlands are in united Europe ITTL since the 1940's, though the Belgium story might still get fleshed out as the redeployment of LoN soldiers to Belgium only insufficiently explains what kind of place Belgium has become since the Bloody Monday in 1981. It's definitely a field to work on.

Interesting thought....elaborate.


You know, I have been asking for people interested in writing stories set in Weimar World. If you'd like to write a little story highlighting such things, I'll check it for continuity and it can be the first of the Tales of Weimar World...


Bring it on!
Fields to work on...
BTW, maps don't change at all after the 1990's.
 
I'm working on a list of German chancellors from 1940 on. Aware of the fact that I cannot fundamentally change the list of presidents as I'd like to (though after L-V the names of the presidents and chancellors are never explicitly mentioned, see the ATL Munich incident), there is a live-saving trigger for my thoughts in the semi-presidential system of the Weimar Republic that most of us rather know from the OTL Fifth French Republic: the possibilty of cohabition.

Some ideas for SPD chancellors in the 1940s and 1950s:
Julius Leber (b. 1891, SPD right-wing, very likely in the 1940s,
IOTL retreated from Reichswehr after Kapp Putsch, SPD's defense expert, died in resistence and was meant to become Minister of the Interior of a provisional Reich government after a successful 1944-7-20 assassination)

Kurt Schumacher (b. 1895, mainstream SPD, surprisingly unlikely,
IOTL SPD whip of the last freely elected Reichstag at a very young age, lost his right arm in WWI in the first war winter, hardly survived several KZs, post-war SPD chief and 1949 chancellor contestant, might survive longer than IOTL as having no burden of KZs)

Erich Ollenhauer (b. 1901, mainstream SPD, rather the 1950s than the 1940s,
IOTL he was in exile and did better than Schumacher, though not absolutely easy, with transforming the SPD from a pure worker party to a "popular party")

This is to be my idea of a list of Presidents and Chancellors of Germany

Year: President/Chancellor
1940 L-V/Adenauer (as canon)
1944 L-V/Leber [1]
1947 Braun/Leber
1951 Braun/Ollenhauer [2]
1954 Braun/Ollenhauer
1955 Adenauer/ random right-wing [3]
1959 Adenauer/ random right-wing
1962 Erhard/ random right-wing
1966 Erhard/ random right-wing or caretaker
1969 Frahm/ random left-wing [4]
1973 Frahm/ random anybody
1976 Frahm/ random left-wing [5]
1981
1986
1991
1996
2001
2006
2011 (your random Jewish Reichspräsident)

[1] I though that having an SPD chancellor as a footstep for an SPD president would be quite plausible, but I thought not to name Braun as chancellor as he might rather appeal to become president directly from his Prussian political past. Leber as a president is too daring IMO, though appealable. As I said, Leber was well respected even in the right.

[2] You might even dismiss Ollenhauer as of 1951 and wait until 1954 with him.

[3a] You might even avoid Braun dying in presidency by simply not standig for vote in 1954, allowing Adenauer to succeed in 1954. Cheering the SPD by re-election and then disposing them the year after is quite dubious to me.

[3b] Though there are many possible chancellors, I prefer 1915-born Franz Josef Strauß. His same-named father was in the BVP (Bavarian Center apostacy) and rejected repeated offers to join the Nazi party as Strauß jr. said, himself was IOTL a German Rab Burton in the sense that he was nearly everything but Federal Chancellor, he led the federal resorts of Defense and Finance under Adenauer and was Bavarian minister president from 1978 onwards and failed to become chancellor after the 1980 elections against Helmut Schmidt.

[4] I thought that Erhard was a brillant economist while not being that much of a brilliant leader. Adenauer tried to bully Erhard off from succeding him a fell after the FDP in his 1963-66 cabinet refused to raise the taxes resulting in the Kiesinger caretaker government of 1966-69. I thought that ITTL he would similarly fall over a reluctance against making social benevolences. Furthermore, a less youthful Brandt/Frahm of 1976 might not be as appealing as that of 1969. I also thought that the internationalist Brandt/Frahm would be a more credible opponent of intolerant. Though Erhard would of course show his distaste for the 1972 Munich aftermath riots as well, people would rather obey a Brandt/Frahm to these words than they would obey an Erhard.

[5] I thought that a semi-presidential democracy of an age similar to the OTL French Fifth Republic as of 2000 might see a similar move: End all the problems with the cohabitions and the premature dissolutions of Reichstag due to that routine. Though five-year-terms weren't really native to Germany except of OTL state parliaments in Germany, five years might be seen as a more sensible term for a presidency than five years anywany and the Reichstag serving five instead of four years (which it did in the Kaiserrich von 1888 till its end) would be a logical consequence. That's why I didn't specify the affiliation of the Chancellor of 1973 by now.
 

Glen

Moderator
Wow! Really some great work there, Dr. Nodelescu. I'd like to hear some commentary from others before we start editing into the timeline, but I guarantee that I will be working a lot of these in. My own commentary will have to wait a bit as I'm tied up at work, but please do continue to elaborate on the ideas. I'd especially like it if we could get some ATL backstory for your proposed Reich leaders, ie, what was their ATL rise to power like in Weimar World....
 

Glen

Moderator
Anyone have any comment about the suggestions below? If not, I will be looking in the next few days to edit in some of them.
 
Just for info: Today is the 90th anniversary of the Weimar national assembly's constituting summit. Our German foreign minister Steinmeier (yes, IOTL) also held a speech there in Weimar. Talking about how necessary it is for democracy to be defended and invented at every time and that it doesn't regret neglection. They're making an exhibition there, trying to get the focus away from "Weimar as failure" to "Weimar as a beginning".
 

Glen

Moderator
Just for info: Today is the 90th anniversary of the Weimar national assembly's constituting summit. Our German foreign minister Steinmeier (yes, IOTL) also held a speech there in Weimar. Talking about how necessary it is for democracy to be defended and invented at every time and that it doesn't regret neglection. They're making an exhibition there, trying to get the focus away from "Weimar as failure" to "Weimar as a beginning".

Thanks for the update.
 

Glen

Moderator
I Wordled Weimar World.

"If you use a screen-capture or other image representation of the Wordle on this page, you must attribute the image to http://www.wordle.net/. Images of Wordles are licensed Creative Commons License."

Weimar World Wordle.PNG
 
As I did in the Chaos TL, I'll do here as well. I picked up the notion of some "Marcel Villeau" ITTL that will definitely not have existed in our lifetime. I wrote an interview about him:

L'historie de l'annihilisme
ou en autres mots
une serie des bâtiments du terreur
(The history of annihilism – or in other words – a series of buildings of fear)​


(Source: Blickpunkt 41/1997, published on 1997-10-9)


Page 265 (last page), category “Retrospect”




What's up with... Marcel Villeau?


Marcel Villeau, born 1952 in Angoulême, Poitou region of France, is to this date best known for his provocative artwork series “Bâtiments Du Désastre” published in 1984, paving the way for the new art style of annihilism. Despite massive campaigns, the series got sold in millions and is further extended with any new incident. After “Batidesa” Villeau ascended to a career as an actor, the last one being “The Fabulous World of Natalie Pétain” playing the role of Natalie's father Jean-Marie.


Blickpunkt: Mr. Villeau, do you dare to walk down the street without bodyguards nowadays again?


Villeau: Days have become calmer the last years. I no longer need to be afraid of hidden conspirators trying to hit me. Not that I earnestly had to fear for my life, except for that sniper back in 1985 right after the non-passage of the anti-annihilist legislation, but there were quite a lot of people just waiting for hitting me with eggs and overripe tomatoes at least.


Blickpunkt: And you no longer fear the fruit bashing anymore?


Villeau: No, I don't. The 1990s have proved to be calmer, at least for the skin of mine. Even if I didn't reconcile with the enemies of my work, they now show a little respect for my work. Mr Ilyushin, who used to lead the “Vladivostok” protests back then, even asked me if he could still obtain an example of my new Zhongghou Commerce Towers replica. Isn't it ironic?


Blickpunkt: True, it is. But how did you get making sculptures of destoyed places? Rumours say that you had the idea quite a time before the Soviet Civil War.


Villeau: Back in 1975, I had a dinner with Minoru Yamasaki in New Orleans and...


Blickpunt: Yamasiki, wasn't he...?


Villeau: Yes, he's that famous brutalist architect whose buildings are disputed to survive very long. I came to the US to find some inspiration in old Louisianian flair. We had some intense talk about the things that were still going on there. The theatre about the Sanger League, recent processes against lynchers, and then he came up with the death of a stepchild project of him, Pruitt-Igoe.


Blickpunkt: Pruitt-Igoe, the stone-made liquidation of technocratic civil engineering?


Villeau: I'd rather call it a first sod turned in the climax of technocracy in civil engineering that led to its ultimate nadir.


Blickpunkt: The climax seeding the nadir? You sound so philosophical saying this as if it weren't really dead.


Villeau: True, they've been speaking about urban renewal for more than thirty years now, but the point is that it still exists. No disrespect to monumental protection, but nobody wants to live in a museum, even if it's nice to watch. And the urban renewal thing that's happening here, you call it gentrification, if I remember correctly, could only take place because the technocratic approach released the old quarters from the burdens of too many people. Otherwise there couldn't have gone poor students into these houses in the middle of the cities. Only because these shelters were abandoned, they could give ground to new seed.


Blickpunkt: And nadir therefore seeded the climax?


Villeau: Absolutely. If you like to call it this way, fine. Though I admit these thoughts first came up later. As I said, Yamasaki and I were in New Orleans and told me about his most futile project. He talked about Pruitt-Igoe, built for the purpose of social housing. And how the whites fled the place as soon as possible while the blacks remained there having nowhere else to go, and how the whole spiral turns that deep down that the only option left to stop it was to eliminate what he created in the first place.


Blickpunkt: That's nothing new, you're not the reason Pruitt-Igoe became prominent.


Villeau: For itself, I'm indeed not to blame for the infame. But in a way it became the seed for Vladivostok. I reminded that we also had these newly constructed residential skycrapers. Sure, de Gaulle was right when he said that we needed more children and that he pushed couples to have more children after the Depression than they were expected to have anyway. Therefore they built these villes nouvelles. But at the time I had a word with Yamasiki, the families that were supposed to live in this kind of shelter had already come to settle down the usual suburban way. First came the Piéd-Noirs, Frenchmen from the other side of the Med afraid of native sabotage, then came the Vietnamese, then came the Arabs and Africans, and with every new wave coming in, the preceding folks were moving out. In the end, when Yamasaki told me about this stuff, I became frightened of what the banlieue could become. Everybody knew about them, but nobody ever cared about them. They became a scapegoat and the ultimate unexample to teach discipline to your children. If you don't follow the rules, you'll become one of them, do you really want that? The kind of shelter you'll find in the Parisian banlieue has a lot in common with Pruitt-Igoe. It's not only not nice, it's that all the nasty problems of a city are purposefully stockpiled there and are hoped to be somehow withered. And that it of course will not have a chance for revitalization, I mean, they are not in any central location away, unlike the old quarters. I already saw these settlements on fire in my mind.


Blickpunkt: But indeed it still took another blow for you to go public. Why then and not earlier?


Villeau: Ordinary people, if they make a decent living and especially if they have little enough sorrows to engange in cultural issues, are happy to afford a blind eye on these issues and take it for granted soly when they live in another quarter and think that these physically near problems were so many light years away. The nuking of Vladivostok was therefore both a consequence and a subversion for my thoughts about the disadvantaged. On the one hand, Vladivostok, like the banlieue on a smaller scale, is in the periphery of its country. If you think of Russia, you think of Moscow and Saint Peterburg, but not of an outpost in the Far East. More and more people landed there with the decades, the quarter of a globe away from the motherland, nothing better to provide for a frontier spirit. On the other hand, nuking a whole city is not just an issue about drowning a social hotspot in some neighborhood, but affects anyone who lives in a range of a diverse social room that makes a city. So in the end, everyone in Vladivostok became kind of an Arab during the Civil War, especially after secession.


Blickpunkt: If we look at the “Vladivostok” sculpture, we come to see a wedge stuck in a faceless block of apartments at the mouth of a harbor. If you don't know what it refers too, you could think that you could essentially have done the same with the blocks of the banlieue.


Villeau: But that's the difference. Would anybody have cared about the banlieue set on fire? Most people wouldn't, they'd just think they were happy enough not to have to do their living there and ask what on earth Marcel Villeau wants with his another social critics, at least until the 89 riots. What these people love about art is that it's educative, which your thought child would have been in an inconvient and pitifully ignorable way. What they hate about it is that it's expressive, that it makes a point on an issue, which is even more inconvenient, outright political. What do you think why Vienna burnt when the Germans came to enforce Anschluss? Adolf Hitler was an artist and artsy Vienna was more than a viable place to inscene the mentality that when yourself can't rule a realm, nobody else shall be able to do so either.


Blickpunkt: But this didn't answer my question.


Villeau: It did and it didn't at the same time. It did because I told you why I didn't make a sculpture about modern slums in the rich world. What I haven't answered, I'll answer you now. Vladivostok was something that nobody could ignore, especially not those who fled to France from misery. When they heard about my sculpture, they didn't think of concrete cracked by a nail with a hammer, they saw themselves on fire, and the comrades of their community on fire, or more precisely, what was left of these communities. This is why art has to be free, everything else is censorship. I still thank Palais Bourbon for restraining from forbidding art when it would have been most severe. It wasn't a victory for me, it was a victory for democracy and open expression of thoughts. And my message.


Blickpunkt: People said that you insisted on no personal protection. People said that's the crucial point why the assassination attempt in 1985 was short of being successful.


Villeau: Well, but remind thoroughly when I say, that they have to be successful only once to succeed while I have to be successful all the time to survive. I thought that personal protection would just attract too much attention and to much human weed to be really desirable. And sniping is of course the only feasible way to even have a chance on killing a protected person. So I thought that it would always be a hit and miss and something just to put up with. In the aftermath, I don't know if I'd done otherwise if I had known then what I know now. I really can't say.


Blickpunkt: You said that your skin became surer with the 1990s. How do you get this conclusion when people never really forgot?


Villeau: The 89 riots. The French Union kicked their motherland out of the club, Paris was not pleased, the world wasn't pleased about Paris either. The French really overestimated their potential to make facts in their supposed backyard which was no longer their backyard at the end of day. That the French didn't test their potential was just to the riots. The French people came to consider if the banlieue and their people really didn't exist, and the French government came to consider it they didn't become the backyard of their supposed backyard. People feared that Algier and Dakar could became new Vladivostoks and they judged that they didn't want to be blamed for making my sculptures reality. People finally acknowledged my work and came to let me live.


Blickpunkt: Do you find it ironic that the French are now promoting to become a backyard of a federating Europe?


Villeau: (visibly laughing) I find it ironic how French politicians harboring an imperialist attitude ten years ago now pretend to be comparably enthusiastic about giving up national sovereignity. But I don't find it ironic in the matter. People say that France won its wars but lost the peace thereafter. The reason why people didn't see it was that not every government screwed things up. We had no problem with letting the Indochinese go, but things went awry when Africa was at stake. There were people that understood, but they were overtoned with de Gaulle wannabes. We could have disbanded, but the leaders were blind. And we can be happy that things didn't become more violent.


Blickpunkt: You'll come to that David Schwarz exhibition in Breslau. People say that Schwarz and you have a love-hate relationship towards one another. What's the real deal?


Villeau: The real deal is that we're very good friends. And that we respect each other artistically. His Entropa is just amazing and he also allowed me a guest appearance there. And as I'm an annihilist and as we'll be in Breslau, I decided to combine the two.


Blickpunkt: You don't want to tell me that you'll be portraying the host town with its recent flood!


Villeau: Oh yes, I will. Do you know the name Max Berg?


Blickpunkt: No, I don't.


Villeau: Then you will!
 
Kabraloth, is it a coincidence that some "Ithanyx" opened the Weimar World entry at tvtropes.org at the same day as set your last post here?

If not, who else is Ithanyx?
 
Let's play a game... or am I to spoil anyway? There are a lot of things from OTL that I put as lampshades into this Villeau interview. That's the whole board's homework for the rest of this decade (meaning, of course, the next two weeks :D)...


  1. Why did I take the year 1997 instead of any other random year of that decade?
  2. The "Retrospect" section of the "Blickpunkt" magazine should be an obvious lampshade for any well informed German on the board. A hint, the mentioned page is the last page of the whole magazine. Of which magazine?
  3. Angoulême, the birthplace of Villeau, was not the birthplace, but at least a place where an important Frenchman IOTL (and probably ITTL as well) was in charge. Who was he?
  4. Gospodin Ilyushin wants to obtain a Zhongghuo Commerce Towers replica. What they don't say is that Yamasaki applied his draft to become the blueprint of aforementioned towers. Shanghai declined back then, because the Pruitt-Igoe story made them believe that Yamasaki's work may be cursed. It didn't help, the Zhongghuo CTs no longer exists. Which is the most (in)famous accomplished building Minoru Yamasaki ever drafted IOTL?
  5. Can you tell me something of a "Batidesa" equivalent in OTL?
  6. Parisian banlieue dwelling on fire. Does this remind you of anything? Do you remind him who said he was going to exterminate the scum there with the pressure washer? Tell me why even a copycat of this OTL character would hardly exist in this timeline.
  7. Villeau's infamous punchline had an interesting structure: "Not a victory for me, it's a victory for the common good, and my whatever!" - Which is the show I took the original wording from, and which character said this on which occasion? I'll give you hint, it's a US-procuded long running animation series.
  8. There is a guy name called David Schwarz you designed some "Entropa" IOTL. It's just his real name germanized. And which country does the real David Schwarz come from?
  9. What does some Max Berg have to do with Breslau?
  10. A personal question to you guys also affecting the interview: Who of you out there have been living in a burden-released inner-city hell-hole that became so artsy that it became incredibly expensive? Anybody?
Looking forward to your answers, Dr. No.
 
I'm not really that patient, and you're really not interested, so I'll spoil the whole thing now.


  1. I didn't apply the butterfly effect to the weather, and the answer is within the article. In 1997, there was the notable Oder flood.
  2. Stern magazine, the last page. It's always in the manner of "Was macht eigentlich...?" (What the hell is ... doing?)
  3. François Mitterand. He's been the major of Angoulême for some time IOTL. His birthplace however was in Jarnac, which isn't that far away either.
  4. Pruitt-Igoe would never have been called this way ITTL, that's my fault, Pruitt and Igoe were WW2 pilots IOTL, which never happen in this timeline. But it was really designed by pre-POD born Yamasaki. Yamasaki's most famous building is the New York World Trade Center with its Twin Towers.
  5. Ever typed in "buidlings of disaster" at Google? 9/11 Twin Towers have been out of sale for a long time now, just as Chernobyl. So yes, my inspiration came from OTL.
  6. On doit nettoyer la racaille au Kärcher, oui? These famous words came from Nicolas Sarkozy. He's got Sephardim heritage in his maternal lineage and his father was a Hungarian noble. No WWII, no Soviets, no need to flee to France and to breed with another outcast.
  7. South Park, episode 1110, Imaginationland I. Cartman gets his right to oral sex from Kyle by court order. His lines are "Thank you, this isn't a victory for me, this is a victory for the court system. And my balls."
  8. Czech Republic, his name is David Černý, the family name meaning "black" or "schwarz" in German.
  9. Max Berg was the designer of Breslau's Centennial Hall, all done before the POD, and still existing in OTL, now better known in Wroclaw as "Hala Ludowa" or alternatively as "Hala Stulecia".
  10. You gave no answers, I'm really not that glad.
 

Glen

Moderator
I'm not really that patient,

Thank God!

and you're really not interested,

I am, I'm just slow...

so I'll spoil the whole thing now.

Yeah!!!

  1. I didn't apply the butterfly effect to the weather, and the answer is within the article. In 1997, there was the notable Oder flood.
  2. Stern magazine, the last page. It's always in the manner of "Was macht eigentlich...?" (What the hell is ... doing?)
  3. François Mitterand. He's been the major of Angoulême for some time IOTL. His birthplace however was in Jarnac, which isn't that far away either.
  4. Pruitt-Igoe would never have been called this way ITTL, that's my fault, Pruitt and Igoe were WW2 pilots IOTL, which never happen in this timeline. But it was really designed by pre-POD born Yamasaki. Yamasaki's most famous building is the New York World Trade Center with its Twin Towers.
  5. Ever typed in "buidlings of disaster" at Google? 9/11 Twin Towers have been out of sale for a long time now, just as Chernobyl. So yes, my inspiration came from OTL.
  6. On doit nettoyer la racaille au Kärcher, oui? These famous words came from Nicolas Sarkozy. He's got Sephardim heritage in his maternal lineage and his father was a Hungarian noble. No WWII, no Soviets, no need to flee to France and to breed with another outcast.
  7. South Park, episode 1110, Imaginationland I. Cartman gets his right to oral sex from Kyle by court order. His lines are "Thank you, this isn't a victory for me, this is a victory for the court system. And my balls."
  8. Czech Republic, his name is David Černý, the family name meaning "black" or "schwarz" in German.
  9. Max Berg was the designer of Breslau's Centennial Hall, all done before the POD, and still existing in OTL, now better known in Wroclaw as "Hala Ludowa" or alternatively as "Hala Stulecia".
  10. You gave no answers, I'm really not that glad.

Interesting tidbits you worked in! I don't live in such a place.
 
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