AH Challenge: Red Alert

Why? If their objective is taking Eastern Europe (and maybe the Balkans), why would they suddenly decide to subject France and Britain? If the Western Powers decide to attack the SU because of its expansion, what`s stopping the Soviets from laying back and waiting for the Western Powers to come to them?

I was assuming Germany would get itself involved. In case it doesn't, then by all means, the Soviets would likely just stop and try to get the allies to accept the new status quo.

How successful the attempt would be remains a question.

This is assuming Germany is a direct goal of the Soviet advance, in which case your scenario would happen. But if the Soviets dont plan on marching below the Branderburg gate, then why would the Wallies and Soviets have a deathmatch in Thuringia?

Because once the Soviets go on the offensive Germany will panic?

Then again, it depends on how far the USSR pushes before coming down on Poland. If it deals with, say, Japan/Manchuria, then Finland, then the Baltic states, all with the stated goal of exporting communism chances are Germany will get involved as they're going to see Poland as merely a stepping stone on the way for the bear with Germany as the next stop (which, mind, it could very well be). Besides, it's better to fight a war on someone else's turf and use the time to build your own army up to scratch.

If it's Poland first and the Soviets offer Germany ... say, 1914 borders, I'd wager Germany might (depending on the government in power at the time) jump on the offer and then you'd have the funny war where neither side can fight the other.
 

Xen

Banned
Well, we could have Hitler die during the Beer Hall Putsch, or just allow for the return of the monarchy as Hidenburg desired. I do not believe that the people after this amount of strife under a Democratic government would mind such a development. Under Wilhelm II (or III if the former proved unacceptable still), Kurt von Schleicher, and Franz von Papen, we can expect similar movements as we did with the Nazi regime. All desired the restoration of Germany's frontiers; this would later include the Kingdom of Austria after its merger with Germany. However, they would not have the military power nor the political power to reclaim Czechia and West Prussia, so diplomatic arangments would be made which left both sides complacent.

The situation with Germany is therefore defused. Then in about 1943 the Second World War starts shortly after the Soviet invasion of Poland, the Baltics, and Finland.

Alfred Hugenberg would be an acceptable German leader in a no-Nazi TL, he shared many of Hitler's goals, and was a crazy son of a bitch, but not nearly as off the deep end as Adolf. So Hugenberg rebuilds the German Army, and to Stalin appears to be a great threat.

Now add the United States into the mix, say the Pacific War occurs on schedule, the US fights the Empire of Japan and fights a major landwar in China in the process. The Americans unwilling to allow the sacrafices of their soldiers to go up in smoke backs the Kuomintang with military force against commies, or forces Mao and Kai Shek to agree to some sort of power sharing deal. So this essentially creates American puppet states in Japan, Korea and China, all a threat to the Soviet flank, while in Europe, Germany is flexing its muscles. Old Uncle Joe begins to believe the western Imperialist powers are trying to encircle the USSR decides to strike first by invading Eastern Europe.

Wham we got Red Alert
 
How successful the attempt would be remains a question.

This depends on how able and how willing they are to change it. They would be able to change it, but not that willing.

If it's Poland first and the Soviets offer Germany ... say, 1914 borders, I'd wager Germany might (depending on the government in power at the time) jump on the offer and then you'd have the funny war where neither side can fight the other.

They dont even have to offer 1914. since nobody but the nuttiest nationalists cared about Posen. Well, at least not all of it. All the Soviets need to do is offer the Germans their cherished Corridor and border corrections in Posen and Upper Silesia.
 
This depends on how able and how willing they are to change it. They would be able to change it, but not that willing.

Im not so sure about this. I mean, the western powers could perhaps drive a fully-mobilised USSR out of the countries it occupied, but could they defeat the USSR in the way Germany was defeated?
 
Im not so sure about this. I mean, the western powers could perhaps drive a fully-mobilised USSR out of the countries it occupied, but could they defeat the USSR in the way Germany was defeated?

Lets see: France, Britain, Italy, a rearmed Germany and a few smaller countries fighting the USSR...

If this isnt enough to bring it down, then I wonder why this website isnt in Russian.
 
(Oh and yes, Britain would certainly respond to Soviet aggression against the eastern states by bombing Baku at the very least. Chamberlain meditated bombing Baku is response to German aggression against the eastern states. France might not be so enthusiastic, but they'd very probably come along for the ride.)

You know, I've wondered a fair bit if the way to provoke Red Alert isn't with Stalin, but rather getting someone a bit rambunctious and hawkish on the Western European side. Imagine Churchill with a nuclear monopoly in a world without World War II.
 
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