AH Challenge: Islamic Viet Nam

Your challenge, should you accept it, is to turn the area known in OTL modern times as Vietnam into a majority-Muslim country with a POD no earlier than 700 AD and no later than 1900. Bonus points if some aspects of Daoism/Buddhism/Confucianism remain as aspects of Islam in Vietnam.
 
Uhh, that's not very hard. Champa controlled much of Central and Southern Vietnam through a good deal of this period, and converted to Islam by the 1700s.

Probably the most recent POD you could have is the last successful king of Champa, Chế Bồng Nga, succeed in his attempts to conquer Vietnam. Probably the best bet is the siege what became Hanoi in 1383 leading to the fall of the city. Butterflies may change the conversion to Islam, since at this time it was only a small religion among the Cham, but keeping the ancestral Hinduism was probably unlikely to last in the long run.
 
Uhh, that's not very hard. Champa controlled much of Central and Southern Vietnam through a good deal of this period, and converted to Islam by the 1700s.

Probably the most recent POD you could have is the last successful king of Champa, Chế Bồng Nga, succeed in his attempts to conquer Vietnam. Probably the best bet is the siege what became Hanoi in 1383 leading to the fall of the city. Butterflies may change the conversion to Islam, since at this time it was only a small religion among the Cham, but keeping the ancestral Hinduism was probably unlikely to last in the long run.

Unless it won't be land of the Viets aka Vietnam, but a Greater Champa.

Which will still be cool :cool: And with the Chams thriving in their own homeland there will interesting consequences in Malaccan strait area, especailly Aceh, because one of Acehnese main ancestors were the Cham refugees fleeing their country.
 
Hmm, that's interesting. Could that mean that "Viet Nam" could get rid of much Chinese influence?

That all depends. Vietnam was far more influenced by China than the rest of Southeast Asia because it was controlled by China essentially continuously from 111 BC to 938 AD. But remember, at this time, "Vietnam" was only the northern regions of the country. The central part of the country was mostly Cham, and the far south was Khmer (Cambodian).

There was essentially no Chinese influence in the rest of Southeast Asia, which was instead heavily influenced by India (everything from written languages to religion, even cuisine). Champa was briefly Mahayana in the 9th and 10th century though, before turning back towards Hinduism (and ultimately Islam). The Cham script was based upon Sanskrit though.

A Champa dominated Vietnam would probably still have a huge Chinese influence in the North. You might even see the rump Vietnamese ethnicity more Sinophilic, as they'd have a more recent oppressor to wish to distance themselves from. That said, I'd assume at minimum the Cham would be able to turn the tide and acculturate many of the Vietnamese in the northern Lowlands to their own language and ethnicity in time.
 
That all depends. Vietnam was far more influenced by China than the rest of Southeast Asia because it was controlled by China essentially continuously from 111 BC to 938 AD. But remember, at this time, "Vietnam" was only the northern regions of the country. The central part of the country was mostly Cham, and the far south was Khmer (Cambodian).

There was essentially no Chinese influence in the rest of Southeast Asia, which was instead heavily influenced by India (everything from written languages to religion, even cuisine). Champa was briefly Mahayana in the 9th and 10th century though, before turning back towards Hinduism (and ultimately Islam). The Cham script was based upon Sanskrit though.

A Champa dominated Vietnam would probably still have a huge Chinese influence in the North. You might even see the rump Vietnamese ethnicity more Sinophilic, as they'd have a more recent oppressor to wish to distance themselves from. That said, I'd assume at minimum the Cham would be able to turn the tide and acculturate many of the Vietnamese in the northern Lowlands to their own language and ethnicity in time.

Hmm, sounds interesting. I guess the Arabic alphabet could be adapted for Cham.
 
A Champa dominated Vietnam would probably still have a huge Chinese influence in the North. You might even see the rump Vietnamese ethnicity more Sinophilic, as they'd have a more recent oppressor to wish to distance themselves from. That said, I'd assume at minimum the Cham would be able to turn the tide and acculturate many of the Vietnamese in the northern Lowlands to their own language and ethnicity in time.

Essentially, the Chams and Viets would switch places ITTL, only that compared to the helpless Chams IOTL's case, the Viets would be having a strong backing in which will buy them quite a time. I suspect if the Chams would want to secure the acquired northern lands from the Viet they will have to have good relationship with China. And depends on how good it would be, the Viet will may going to be assimilated very quickly in the best case for the Chams.

Hmm, sounds interesting. I guess the Arabic alphabet could be adapted for Cham.

Well, IOTL after the Cham people became solidly muslim, they still sticked with their Pallava-derived alphabet. And looking at the pattern of the conversion, with the lower class converted to Islam earlier than the higher class, it's safe to assume the Chams are fairly critical in adopting foreign ideas to their culture. I will guess that ITTL the Cham would retain their Pallavic script, just like the Javanese IOTL. Speaking of the Javanese, IOTL upon the dawn of Islam to Java, the process of Islamization didn't go as rapid as in Sumatra which was more trade-oriented. Islam in Java was also first embraced by lower classes and northern coastal traders, in which eventually manifested in revolt in the form of Demak Sultanate. In fact Sultanate of Mataram was formed also to revenge the destruction of Majapahit by the northerner orthodox Muslim Javanese, and they won. Hence we got the form of Islamic practices being applied in most of Java today. The Chams, baring similar pattern of conversion, is quite tastefull to be assumed to be quite critical in Islamization, if only they'd be also the only nation to be associated with Islam in their region, it will maybe less so compared to Javanese, but just enough, if not more, if just to maintain their original script. Not to mention the interesting fact there was apparently at least one royal marriage between members of both nations' royalties.
 
Hmm, interesting. However, how could we get it so that the Arabic alphabet becomes the sole alphabet for writing Cham in TTL, or a variant of Cham thereof that might acquire features from the language of the Viets?

Well, IOTL after the Cham people became solidly muslim, they still sticked with their Pallava-derived alphabet. And looking at the pattern of the conversion, with the lower class converted to Islam earlier than the higher class, it's safe to assume the Chams are fairly critical in adopting foreign ideas to their culture. I will guess that ITTL the Cham would retain their Pallavic script, just like the Javanese IOTL. Speaking of the Javanese, IOTL upon the dawn of Islam to Java, the process of Islamization didn't go as rapid as in Sumatra which was more trade-oriented. Islam in Java was also first embraced by lower classes and northern coastal traders, in which eventually manifested in revolt in the form of Demak Sultanate. In fact Sultanate of Mataram was formed also to revenge the destruction of Majapahit by the northerner orthodox Muslim Javanese, and they won. Hence we got the form of Islamic practices being applied in most of Java today. The Chams, baring similar pattern of conversion, is quite tastefull to be assumed to be quite critical in Islamization, if only they'd be also the only nation to be associated with Islam in their region, it will maybe less so compared to Javanese, but just enough, if not more, if just to maintain their original script. Not to mention the interesting fact there was apparently at least one royal marriage between members of both nations' royalties.
 
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