AH Challenge: Earliest possible independent colony

archaeogeek

Banned
Not the same people (I mean in terms of being the same tribe not in terms of both being inuit; in fact they might not have been the same people at all since the area also has cree and atikamek groups), also if they're Inuit, the Skraeling are only recently from Asia on a great scale and would not be affected by the die off; this is also just around the time we stop finding bows in inuit culture on the continent. If the vikings are going to be a problem, they're going to meet groups that can easily crush them.

Even 10% of the population of the americas can still overwhelm 11th century vikings, and the die off was most likely closer to 80 than to 90%. Even if it's 90%, there's still 4000 Beothuk on Vinland alone.
 
Sure.

One thing I have always been (actually two things) curious about:

1. The Norse seemed to get along with the 'skraelings" in Greenland, but those in Vinland seemed to be more agressive. Why?
The Norse were there first in Greenland. The eskimos encountered farmers and fishermen and the like. Peaceful folk.
In Vinland the norse were the invaders. It was adventurers which stumbled on the natives.
2. After Columbus there was a great period of dying amongst the natives, some estimates say that 90 - 95 % of 'Amerindians' died, possibly reducing the population in the Americas from 100 million to less than 10 million. This die-off due to smallpox and other diseases. Could we incorporate this? It would make it easier for the Norse to conqueor with no firearms.
Firearms are unimportant.
Far more important for the Spanish was steel.
 
I've occasionally wondered if New England could've broken off during the English Civil War or the Glorious Revolution. Not sure it would've lasted very long, but independence all the same...
 
Sure.

One thing I have always been (actually two things) curious about:

1. The Norse seemed to get along with the 'skraelings" in Greenland, but those in Vinland seemed to be more agressive. Why?
because there weren't any, initially. Afterwards, the Inuit moved into the north where the Greenlanders weren't. There was some conflict.
 
The first 'independent colony' was the United States, as you all know.

How early can discovery of the New World and colonization of it occur?
What is the earliest possible time a colony could become independent?
How can colonization be accelerated, and at an early time?


The POD must in 1000 or 1001 at the establishment of Vinland. However you can't just have Vinland survive and lose contact, that's too easy. If your scenario involves Vinland becoming independent, then Vinland must keep contact with the Vikings before fighting for its independence some time later.

EDIT: To all Captain Obviouses: They must be in the Americas.
Errr... Become independent from whom?

Iceland and Greenland were both independent until ??1270??, at which point Iceland's politics had become so toxic they welcomed the rule of Norway.

If Vinland existed, no European power would rule it, it would have been independent from day one.
 
Yes, I was waiting for someone to point out that Norse Greenland pretty much was independent for its first several centuries of existence. It was founded by Icelanders but Iceland never asserted control over it.

There's also Quilombo dos Palmares, the large polity of fugitive slaves that existed in the Brazilian hinterlands.

And then there's the strange situation that existed in New Mexico following Pope's Rebellion and its reconquest by Spain. At the very least, Santa Fe still functioned and it was independent.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
There were maroon communities in the peripheral areas like Texas and the western Mississippi, as well, although those are late 17th-18th centuries...
They might not count as independent colonies, but the european influence was strong there: the Missiones region had a denser population than the rest of rio de la plata and could have been recognized as a Guarani state? Early Paraguay.
 
There were maroon communities in the peripheral areas like Texas and the western Mississippi, as well, although those are late 17th-18th centuries...
They might not count as independent colonies, but the european influence was strong there: the Missiones region had a denser population than the rest of rio de la plata and could have been recognized as a Guarani state? Early Paraguay.

I would agree that a "maroon state" would definitely count as an independent colony in the same way that Haiti counts as an independent colony.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
I would agree that a "maroon state" would definitely count as an independent colony in the same way that Haiti counts as an independent colony.

Sorry my syntax was bad, the part I was wondering whether it counted was the Guarani missiones, not the maroons XD
 
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