AH Challenge= Confusion Reigns!

BurningWickerman · Jul 1, 2005

I was reading this pieces on the causes of WW2 on wikipedia:

World War II may be the single most complicated conflict in all of history and it is therefore difficult to explain its origin. Never have so many nations gone to war in so many different ways and by so many different means

And that got my thinking, how much more complicated could WW2 have gotten.

So a challenge: A WW2 even more confusing than OTL, with 3 (or more) way fighting, dozens of alliances, shifting treatys/agreements/allies, civil wars, revolutions, truely world wide fighting, and other randomness.
A POD of no earlier than 1930.

Bonus points for new ideologies and fighting in Australia.

wkwillis · Jul 1, 2005

The communist coup in Brazil succeeds in the thirties. You want a world war, I'll give you a world war!

Rhesus2 · Jul 1, 2005

Ok, here's some more complications:

Hitler breaks off ties to Japan after they refuse to go to war against Russia, calling them "soft on communism." While there won't be much of a shooting war, there is no trade of advisors or technology (so no Japanese Kikka jet)

Have the allies see the USSR as just as dangerous an enemy as Germany, and let them face off against HItler without any support or lend lease aid. For the allies, it's a win-win situation. Whoever ultimatey wins the conflict will be so battered it'll be much easier to take them down.

Also, keep the Vichy government in power in France for longer, leading to a protracted Vichy/Free French civil war on the tail end of Germany's withdrawl from France. Neither wants Germany in the country, but neither wants the other in charge either. And, just for fun, have Franco move in across the Pyrenees to see what he can hold in the chaos of the French conflict.

Straha · Jul 1, 2005

Have the gunpowder putch against FDR go off sucessfully. We see a second ACW i nthe 30's and 40's...

Superdude · Jul 1, 2005

I doubt it, because America generally relies on the democratic process.

The nation in the 1930s was alot different from the 1850s-60s.

Fenwick · Jul 1, 2005

The Japanese take Papua New Gieuna, and start sending bombing missions against Austrilia. As the US tries to take Midway back, the Japanese army makes a successful landing in Caims in Northern Australia. Fiji it taken and the British naval base is used as a stagin point for the push down the Austrilian coast. By 1943 Sydney is attacked by Japanese bombers. The Japanese never make it deep into Austrilia but their presence is known as it is in China.

Mike Stearns · Jul 1, 2005

How about this? Hitler keeps his peace treaty with Russia, deciding that its far better for him to have Stalin as an ally rather than an enemy. Mussolini renegs on the Tri-partite pact and joins the Allies, resulting Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan and Communist Russia joining together to divy up the world. The three most fanatical nations of the 1930 and 40s are now allies. If you thought Stalingrad was bad in OTL, wait until you see it when the Red Army can call on the SS and the Luftwaffe for support.

BTW I forgot to mention that the Italians are just as useless in this TL as in OTL and do nothing but burden the Allies with unnecessary problems.

Justin Pickard · Jul 2, 2005

A successful Mäntsälä Rebellion in Finland in 1932 sends Finland Fascist - leads to a far more severe Russo-Finnish 'Winter War'.

Have the Spanish Civil War go hot, with far more open and direct foreign intervention overspilling into France and Italy, and then further.

Gustav Stressman survives for a bit longer, delaying the introduction of Nazism by a couple of years. He also manages to regain the Polish corridor for Germany before his death. Nazis finally sieze power in 1935, with far more opposition within Germany.

In WW2 itself, Keep America and Russia fighting defensive wars, and not actually joining the Allies. Italy not saved from defeat in Greece and Albania by Hitler, leading to an Italian counter-revolution fostered by the Allied forces.

BurningWickerman · Jul 2, 2005

Rhesus2 said:
Also, keep the Vichy government in power in France for longer, leading to a protracted Vichy/Free French civil war on the tail end of Germany's withdrawl from France. Neither wants Germany in the country, but neither wants the other in charge either. And, just for fun, have Franco move in across the Pyrenees to see what he can hold in the chaos of the French conflict.

A successful Mäntsälä Rebellion in Finland in 1932 sends Finland Fascist - leads to a far more severe Russo-Finnish 'Winter War'.

In WW2 itself, Keep America and Russia fighting defensive wars, and not actually joining the Allies. Italy not saved from defeat in Greece and Albania by Hitler, leading to an Italian counter-revolution fostered by the Allied forces.

I thought thse 3 were paticularly inspired. Keep em going.

Melvin Loh · Jul 3, 2005

Well, OTL in conquered European colonies in Asia like the NEI and Indochina, there were instances of the nationalist forces fighting both the Japanese occupiers and domestic opponents, as was the case also in occupied Europe- as with Yugoslavia and the 3-way conflicts bteween Partisans, CHETNIKS, and collaborationist forces like the USTASE and their Nazi supporters.