Does anybody have new or old Pod's for an Independent Confederacy maybe ideas for wars, alliances and stuff like that b/c I am makin a TL
AH Challenge: Confederate TL
- Thread starter ConfederateFly
- Start date
Some things that may be considered in the development of a CSA-TL is the history of South Africa. The aspects of South African apartheid may act as an important development in the ATL. For instance, you could have MLK Jr. become the analogy for Nelson Mandela. Starting in 1965 until 1989, you could use conflicts in Central America and Mexico as ATL analogies to Angola and Rhodesia. You could have Malcolm Little (OTL's Malcolm X) become the ATL's analogy for Steven Biko. You could have Jesse Helms in 1985, defend apartheid. You could also throw in the Tuskegee medical experiments, wherein until 1973, African-Americans were subjected to brutal medical experiments. By 1995, you can also have the Truth and Reconciliation Trials similar to South Africa's to grant amnesty to CSA police and military officials.
That assumes that the attitude of the CSA remains racist. As has been mentioned, its quite possible that race relations would improve if slavery died a "natural" death.
In light of Rhodesia, Angola, South Africa, Rwanda, and even Quebec, it is hard to believe there would be any situation that would arise, wherein the institution of slavery wouldn't have a damning and extremely painful memory for African-Americans in the CSA. Even today in places like Brazil and Australia, wherein the experience of discrimination was worked out differently, the issue of race serves as one of the primary issues that defines the candidates. Consider how "Pollyannish" or insulting it sounds to African-Americans, the idea that market-driven forces would allow people to allow African-Americans to be assimilated into mainstream society, after neary 400 years of slavery.
Michael E Johnson
Banned
---Consider how "Pollyannish" or insulting it sounds to African-Americans, the idea that market-driven forces would allow people to allow African-Americans to be assimilated into mainstream society, after neary 400 years of slavery---
You are expecting some of the people that post here to do that Jose? Talk about Pollyanish
You are expecting some of the people that post here to do that Jose? Talk about Pollyanish
Michael E Johnson
Banned
---You could have Malcolm Little (OTL's Malcolm X) become the ATL's analogy for Steven Biko. ----
But OTL Malcolm was from Nebraska right? His family probably moved there from the South so I guess in the ATL they would remain there. Strom is president in the 1940's? LBJ in the "liberal" 60's? Some good ideas there.
But OTL Malcolm was from Nebraska right? His family probably moved there from the South so I guess in the ATL they would remain there. Strom is president in the 1940's? LBJ in the "liberal" 60's? Some good ideas there.
Here are a few dates that maybe helpful, barring the dreaded "butterfly effect"
1948: Apartheid
Urbanization and economic growth fuel white fears that CSA racial barriers will collapse. The National Party introduces apartheid (separateness) measures against blacks, Indian immigrants and those of mixed race.
1950s: Resistance to apartheid
Under the leadership of W.E.B. DuBois -- and Johannesburg law partners Ralph Abernathy and Martin Luther King Jr. -- the SNCC organizes a passive resistance campaign against apartheid and issues the Freedom Charter. The government suppresses the movement and begins arresting SNCC leaders.
1976: Nationwide riots
Thousands of students in the black township of Atlanta stage protests to demand they be taught in English rather than the "Ebonics". Police fire on the demonstrators, sparking nationwide riots and more repression. Police kill more than 500 protesters within a year, including leading activist Malcolm Little.
1984: Tutu wins Nobel Peace Prize
Baptist Minister Jesse Jackson is awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for his non-violent campaign to end apartheid. He criticizes U.S. President Ronald Reagan's "quiet diplomacy" against apartheid and urges a more forceful stance.
1986: Economic sanctions
The European Community and United States impose economic sanctions on the CSA. The tougher CSA measures ban the import of South African agriculture, and prohibit U.S. loans and investment to CSA.
1987: Railway strike
A strike by black railway workers leads to the worst violence in CSA since the government declared a national state of emergency in 1986. Eleven workers were killed and more than 60 trains damaged or destroyed in firebomb attacks before the government met workers' demands.
1989: Clinton comes to power
(Jesse Helms or Pat Robertson) steps down as National Party leader and president of CSA. He is replaced by the younger, more charismatic William J. Clinton, who is more sensitive to the growing anti-apartheid movement.
1990: Martin Luther King Jr. freed
President Bill Clinton announces radical changes. SNCC leader Martin Luther King Jr. is released after 27 years in captivity. Basic apartheid laws and the nationwide state of emergency are ended.
1993: Transition to 'democracy'
Clinton, King and representatives from 18 other parties agree on an interim constitution that paves the way for historic all-race elections. All citizens over 18 are allowed to vote, and a long list of social and political rights are guaranteed. Clinton and King are awarded the Nobel Peace Prize.
1994: King elected
King's SNCC wins 63 percent of the vote in April elections. World leaders gather on May 10 as Mandela is sworn in as president of the new CSA.
1948: Apartheid
Urbanization and economic growth fuel white fears that CSA racial barriers will collapse. The National Party introduces apartheid (separateness) measures against blacks, Indian immigrants and those of mixed race.
1950s: Resistance to apartheid
Under the leadership of W.E.B. DuBois -- and Johannesburg law partners Ralph Abernathy and Martin Luther King Jr. -- the SNCC organizes a passive resistance campaign against apartheid and issues the Freedom Charter. The government suppresses the movement and begins arresting SNCC leaders.
1976: Nationwide riots
Thousands of students in the black township of Atlanta stage protests to demand they be taught in English rather than the "Ebonics". Police fire on the demonstrators, sparking nationwide riots and more repression. Police kill more than 500 protesters within a year, including leading activist Malcolm Little.
1984: Tutu wins Nobel Peace Prize
Baptist Minister Jesse Jackson is awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for his non-violent campaign to end apartheid. He criticizes U.S. President Ronald Reagan's "quiet diplomacy" against apartheid and urges a more forceful stance.
1986: Economic sanctions
The European Community and United States impose economic sanctions on the CSA. The tougher CSA measures ban the import of South African agriculture, and prohibit U.S. loans and investment to CSA.
1987: Railway strike
A strike by black railway workers leads to the worst violence in CSA since the government declared a national state of emergency in 1986. Eleven workers were killed and more than 60 trains damaged or destroyed in firebomb attacks before the government met workers' demands.
1989: Clinton comes to power
(Jesse Helms or Pat Robertson) steps down as National Party leader and president of CSA. He is replaced by the younger, more charismatic William J. Clinton, who is more sensitive to the growing anti-apartheid movement.
1990: Martin Luther King Jr. freed
President Bill Clinton announces radical changes. SNCC leader Martin Luther King Jr. is released after 27 years in captivity. Basic apartheid laws and the nationwide state of emergency are ended.
1993: Transition to 'democracy'
Clinton, King and representatives from 18 other parties agree on an interim constitution that paves the way for historic all-race elections. All citizens over 18 are allowed to vote, and a long list of social and political rights are guaranteed. Clinton and King are awarded the Nobel Peace Prize.
1994: King elected
King's SNCC wins 63 percent of the vote in April elections. World leaders gather on May 10 as Mandela is sworn in as president of the new CSA.
Michael E Johnson
Banned
--King's SNCC wins 63 percent of the vote in April elections. World leaders gather on May 10 as Mandela is sworn in as president of the new CSA.---
what % of the population are blacks in this CSA?
what % of the population are blacks in this CSA?
Straha
Banned
In an ATL where the South won, I can overhear the arguments at a border crossing between Missouri and Arkansas.
"I'm sorry, sir. Private handguns and rifles are not allowed in the United States. They were banned after the assassination of President Garfield."
--- Geezus, what kind of sissies are you Yanks?
"Tough enough to win all three of the Wars Between the States, sir. Here is a brochure on United States hate crimes, warning foreigners that certain activities are strictly prohibited on penalty of imprisonment."
--- No protests at marriages for homosexuals and lesbians, or between
whites and blacks! No protests outside abortion clinics! No demonstrations at schools against teaching evolution or busing! No demonstrations outisde of shops selling porn or dope or liquor! No marching in Confederate or Klan uniforms! You Yanks practice thought control.
"No, sir. We've gone our way and you've gone your way. Your first president said you Rebs only wanted to be left alone. If that is your belief, sir, then stay in the Confederacy."
"I'm sorry, sir. Private handguns and rifles are not allowed in the United States. They were banned after the assassination of President Garfield."
--- Geezus, what kind of sissies are you Yanks?
"Tough enough to win all three of the Wars Between the States, sir. Here is a brochure on United States hate crimes, warning foreigners that certain activities are strictly prohibited on penalty of imprisonment."
--- No protests at marriages for homosexuals and lesbians, or between
whites and blacks! No protests outside abortion clinics! No demonstrations at schools against teaching evolution or busing! No demonstrations outisde of shops selling porn or dope or liquor! No marching in Confederate or Klan uniforms! You Yanks practice thought control.
"No, sir. We've gone our way and you've gone your way. Your first president said you Rebs only wanted to be left alone. If that is your belief, sir, then stay in the Confederacy."
Michael- According to reports by the U.S. Census, the African-American population accounted for 42% of the populace of the CSA in 1890. In the cities, as much as 50% of the populace was African-American. It wasn't until the Northern Migration of the 1930s and 1940s, did the number of th e African-American community shrink with the provision of jobs in the local factories.
Straha- Also consider the idea that you can certainly combine the historical itms of OTL's Nothern Ireland and Mexico. As such, you can certainly see the political chaos involved. Try to imagine Pancho Villa, with the intent of trying to liberate Guerrero, and Nueva Tejas.
Straha- Also consider the idea that you can certainly combine the historical itms of OTL's Nothern Ireland and Mexico. As such, you can certainly see the political chaos involved. Try to imagine Pancho Villa, with the intent of trying to liberate Guerrero, and Nueva Tejas.