AH Challenge: A Cold War between Communism and Islamism

With a POD anytime before or after 1900, the challenge is create a Cold War type scenario between Communism and Islamism. The Cold War has to be in the late 20th century (or earlier), the Communist and Islamist camps have to be led by a superpower, there must be nuclear weapons, an arms race, a space race, proxy wars, etc. and anything else from the OTL Cold War.
 
Actually, it's not that hard. Just have the Moors win the battle of Poitiers and create a Western Europe that was Muslim, not Christian. Everything else should fall into place after that.
 
Actually, it's not that hard. Just have the Moors win the battle of Poitiers and create a Western Europe that was Muslim, not Christian. Everything else should fall into place after that.

I think that this would butterfly away communism as we know it. IMO, the POD would have to be more recently.
 

Goldstein

Banned
Maybe the key isn't making islamism more successful, but communism. In a the-gladiator-ish scenario, islamism could emerge and spread even more than IOTL, in opposition to the atheist and materialistic elements of communism... and ultimately, lead to an alliance of islamic republics or even an islamist UAR. This would be a very asymmetrical cold war, but if these islamist countries manage themselves well enough, it's done.
 
Suppose we managed to make China Islamic in the 19th or 20th century somehow. Would that count?


Then again, our best possibility may be with India or some outgrowth of Egypt. Presumably, the POD should follow publication of The Communist Manifesto.
 
Here are a few people who have claimed to be the "Mahdi" or Muslim equivalent of the Messiah. As such, a more successful campaign at winning converts by any of these people would certainly lead to the desired ATL. Islamic tradition has a prophecy of the Mahdi, who will come alongside the return of Isa (Jesus).

Syed Mohammad Jaunpuri (1443-1505)- who travelled Northeastern India; he influenced the Mahdavia and the Zikris.

Báb (1819-1850)- who declared himself to be the promised Mahdi in Shiraz, Iran in 1844.

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (1835-1908)- of Qadian, 'the Promised Messiah' return of Jesus as well as the 'Mahdi', founder of the Ahmadiyya religious movement.

Muhammad Ahmad ("The Mad Mahdi") (1844-1885)-who declared himself the Mahdi in 1881, defeated the Ottomans, and founded a short-lived empire in Sudan.

Sayyid Mohammed Abdullah Hassan (1864-1920)- of Somaliland who engaged in military conflicts from 1900 to 1920.

Rashad Khalifa (1935-1990)- a numerologist who analyzed the Qu'ran; claimed to be the "Messenger of the Covenant" and founded the "Submitters International" movement before being murdered.

Juhayman al-Otaibi (1936-1980)- who seized the Grand Mosque in Mecca in November 1979 and declared his son-in-law the Mahdi.
 
Here are a few people who have claimed to be the "Mahdi" or Muslim equivalent of the Messiah. As such, a more successful campaign at winning converts by any of these people would certainly lead to the desired ATL. Islamic tradition has a prophecy of the Mahdi, who will come alongside the return of Isa (Jesus).

Syed Mohammad Jaunpuri (1443-1505)- who travelled Northeastern India; he influenced the Mahdavia and the Zikris.

Báb (1819-1850)- who declared himself to be the promised Mahdi in Shiraz, Iran in 1844.

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (1835-1908)- of Qadian, 'the Promised Messiah' return of Jesus as well as the 'Mahdi', founder of the Ahmadiyya religious movement.

Muhammad Ahmad ("The Mad Mahdi") (1844-1885)-who declared himself the Mahdi in 1881, defeated the Ottomans, and founded a short-lived empire in Sudan.

Sayyid Mohammed Abdullah Hassan (1864-1920)- of Somaliland who engaged in military conflicts from 1900 to 1920.

Rashad Khalifa (1935-1990)- a numerologist who analyzed the Qu'ran; claimed to be the "Messenger of the Covenant" and founded the "Submitters International" movement before being murdered.

Juhayman al-Otaibi (1936-1980)- who seized the Grand Mosque in Mecca in November 1979 and declared his son-in-law the Mahdi.

All of them heretics.....
 
Ottoman Empire resurgence successfully as the start point ?

I've got a thought where the Ottomans become the Islamist superpower but it comes close to ASB. So it goes like this; World War I (the Ottomans and Americans manage to stay neutral ITTL) lasts until the 20's and ends with the complete social and economic collapse of most of Europe. In the ensuing chaos, the Communists take over and establish a Europewide Soviet Union.

The Ottomans then send their armies to Africa in an attempt to salvage Old Europe's colonial possessions which the new Soviet Europe couldn't manage to hold on to. So, it's Soviet Europe vs. the Greater Ottoman Caliphate. I don't know what could happen from there though.
 
I think that this would butterfly away communism as we know it. IMO, the POD would have to be more recently.

That's a good point. Sorry, knee-jerk reaction on my part, jumping to Poitiers like that.

A more limited Communist-Islamic cold war could have taken place with a Communist India (not hard to imagine) and Pakistan. Of course, that doesn't meet the requirements for a grandiose superpower-led Cold War.

I suppose if you assume a revitalized Ottoman Empire it could work, but there's a reason it was called "The Sick Man of Europe". I'm not sure that simply staying out of WWI would be enough for a Turkish resurgence sufficient to make them a superpower. I think one of the problems with this scenario is that creating a Muslim superpower relies on a POD long before the 20th century. By the 20th century, the West was so far ahead of the most powerful Muslim nations that creating a superpower is impossible. But if you go back too far, you risk averting the advent of communism.
 
I've got a thought where the Ottomans become the Islamist superpower but it comes close to ASB. So it goes like this; World War I (the Ottomans and Americans manage to stay neutral ITTL) lasts until the 20's and ends with the complete social and economic collapse of most of Europe. In the ensuing chaos, the Communists take over and establish a Europewide Soviet Union.

The Ottomans then send their armies to Africa in an attempt to salvage Old Europe's colonial possessions which the new Soviet Europe couldn't manage to hold on to. So, it's Soviet Europe vs. the Greater Ottoman Caliphate. I don't know what could happen from there though.

Does this work? And does anyone have anymore such scenarios that can lead to the desired Cold War?
 
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