Affiliated States of Boreoamerica thread

Just for shits and giggles, the ASB organized into 13 commonwealths like in Fallout.

If fun not allowed, perhaps we can delve into architectural drawing a la Skyscraperpage? Tallest/most prominent man-made structure in each state.
If you want to show a post-apocalyptic Boreoamerica, I'm certainly not going to stop you!

Now skyscrapers present an interesting question. Invented in the United States, how would a radically different culture affect their development? I assume someone would invent something like them eventually, but where, when and how are open questions.

Why does new-hampshire have an enclave in Canada ?
I haven't fully written the history yet, but that is the Madawaska Republic. The circumstances behind its secession are completely different, but I wanted to include it. The OTL Madawaskans were American settlers who wanted their homesteads to be US territory. In TTL, it was disaffected Acadians. They were unhappy with French policy after France resumed direct control of the Acadia colony in the 1830s. They moved to an area where the borders were vague and declared a republic. Soon New Hampshire came forward as their champion, hoping to extend its own borders in that direction. In the end the border was more favorable to Canada, but New Hampshire got to keep Madawaska as an exclave.

Where did you get the basemap for your Northeast map? (just asking)
It is this map: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:New_England_and_South-East_of_Canada_topographic_map-blank.svg
 
Just for shits and giggles, the ASB organized into 13 commonwealths like in Fallout.

If fun not allowed, perhaps we can delve into architectural drawing a la Skyscraperpage? Tallest/most prominent man-made structure in each state.
Aww, I can't see the image, but I wish I could. D:
 
New intro
I am going to post the updated version of the very first post on this thread. So much has been written in the last few years that I think many people would appreciate a general introduction to the project.

The ASB


The ASB is a project to create an alternate version of North America. In the years since I started it, a lot of other people have contributed their own ideas, stories, and artwork.

The idea for it came from reading Richard White's history The Middle Ground. This remarkable book describes the world of the Great Lakes in the colonial era. Around the Lakes, the notion of the Frontier, a dividing line between cultures, did not exist. Instead, colonists and Indians inhabited a shared world. The dominant social and political structures combined things European and indigenous.

The master plan of the ASB was to take the world of the Middle Ground and extend it: to bring it forward in time to the present and further out in space to cover most of eastern North America. Along the way, I started tossing in anything from North American history and culture that I found interesting, exposing a few of the deep buried roots of our past.

The result is a world that has been called "utopian", and aspects of it certainly are. I certainly don't think that this realistically could have come about if things had gone differently in 1759 or 1665 or any other time. It's just a setting that I enjoy working on. So in that sense, while it looks a lot like Alternate History, strictly speaking that's not what the ASB is. That's why I chose the name: in the world of alternate history, ASB means "unrealistic" or "impossible". I want the setting to feel lifelike, but in terms of the historical events, realism is not the goal.

So what is the ASB?

The Affiliated States of Boreoamerica (pronounced "bor-EH-o-a-MER-i-ca") is a confederation of fifty states. Some are former colonies, some are former indigenous chiefdoms, and others are mixed states created through the cooperation of Europeans and Indians.

Where did it come from?

It arose gradually from the alliances that began in colonial times. The predecessors of the ASB were the different interlocking alliances between imperial powers and local nations. The Indians of the Great Lakes were linked to New France as the Children of Onontio; New Netherland, Iroquoia, and some of the smaller tribes of the Alleghenies were bound in the Covenant Chain; while the same tribes often met with the English colonies in a series of Congresses.

The system of alliances gave rise to a few permanent institutions for mediating disputes. The states formed an increasingly dense network of relationships. Little by little, these relationships and institutions came to be regarded as different bodies of a single confederation. It's a little like the European Institutions in our world.

In its modern form, the ASB emerged in the middle of the nineteenth century. During that era, the European powers lost control of most of their colonies and stopped directly governing those that remained. The elected institutions of the ASB, namely Parliament, slowly assumed some of the powers of a government. The individual states surrendered some of their sovereign powers, above all the power to wage war. Before the 19th century was over, the ASB had become something like a sovereign country.

How does it work?

The ASB is a patchwork of states with very different systems of government - to the point where a few former colonies have remained monarchies while most have not. Some states have presidential systems; others have adopted Westminster-style parliaments. The states that evolved from Native chiefdoms and Métis alliances have their own distinct political traditions to add still more variety.

The ASB as a whole is governed by Parliament. Representation is by state delegation; apportionment among the states is based on population. Parliament selects the Chief Minister, who is the head of government. Parliament also chooses the Grand Council of State, a body that acts as the collective "Head of State", via a system designed to select mostly uncontroversial consensus figures that represent as many states as possible. The Grand Council in turn chooses its own President, who also acts as foreign minister. This separation of the foreign ministry from the parliamentary Government gives the ASB's foreign policy an apolitical character with a strong inclination toward nonintervention and neutrality.

Where is the capital?

For the first few decades of its existence, the ASB had no capital. Congresses and parliaments met in various places. Eventually, however, a permanent place had to be chosen. The honor went to the city of Two Forts.

Two Forts is strategically located on the Forks of the Ohio. The site had long been contested first by the French and English, then by various competing states. The area around is populated by a mixed group of people speaking an array of European and indigenous languages; both French and English function as local lingua francas.

Besides being located near the geographic center of the ASB, Deux Forts is accessible to two of the confederation's main arterial waterways, the Ohio River and the Great Lakes/St. Lawrence. It is the crossroads of two old, major roads,today known as the Allegheny Turnpike and the Great Northeast Trace. It is inside Allegheny State, but just across the border of Ohio and near the borders of Upper Connecticut and Iroquoia.

________________________________________________

On Journeys Through the States

On journeys through the States we start,
(Ay through the world, urged by these songs,
Sailing henceforth to every land, to every sea,)
We willing learners of all, teachers of all, and lovers of all.

We have watch'd the seasons dispensing themselves and passing on,
And have said, Why should not a man or woman do as much as the seasons, and effuse as much?

We dwell a while in every city and town,
We pass through Kanada, the North-east, the vast valley of the Mississippi, and the Southern States,
We confer on equal terms with each of the States,
We make trial of ourselves and invite men and women to hear,
We say to ourselves, Remember, fear not, be candid, promulge the body and the soul,
Dwell a while and pass on, be copious, temperate, chaste, magnetic,
And what you effuse may then return as the seasons return,
And may be just as much as the seasons.

~ Walt Whitman
 
It's great to see how far this project has come since its beginning. Are the various independent countries around the ASB official now, or are they (other than the previously elaborated upon Mexico and Rupertsland) just placeholders?
 
What's the population of the ASB? With so many borders to cross and no tsunami of English settlers, I get the feeling that these areas are a lot less densely populated than they are in OTL.
 
Was a world map of the ASB universe ever created? I know this crosses over with another timeline so I was wondering what the world looks like. I'm sure there is a lot of empty spaces still, but seeing the big picture might be cool.
 
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It's great to see how far this project has come since its beginning. Are the various independent countries around the ASB official now, or are they (other than the previously elaborated upon Mexico and Rupertsland) just placeholders?
Dat Megayucatan. I guess, Maya-dominated, keeping with the themes of this world?

Also the irony of Puerto Rico being independent from ASB.

And why Belize is Valiz? I guess there’s an interesting story behind that.
To answer both of these: The Union of Antillean States is the most fleshed out nation visible on that map. Pempelune wrote about it a few months ago. (Here's the post.)

The borders of the little countries inside North America are pretty much final. They've appeared on a couple of maps. Lakotah has been around practically since page 1 of this thread, so it's definitely official. The other two have more placeholder-y names, they're both named for tribes and/or rivers in the area. People have suggested Mennonite or Mormon states. Honestly those both felt kind of gimicky to me, but who knows. Maybe they're waiting for a brilliant idea, or maybe they're simply ordinary settler states for people who wanted to move beyond the law.

Either way, at least two, possibly all three, of the prairie nations are in a kind of free-association with the ASB. There are some Pacific island nations, former colonies of individual states like Massachusetts and New Netherland, that also have this kind of relationship. Some of the Californian states did formerly.

Central America is definitely full of placeholders. I was thinking a state with lots of Mayas in Yucatan, but Spanish colonial boundaries could easily have been drawn that way rather than as they were in OTL. Giving Petén to Guatemala was fairly arbitrary (as far as I know). But yeah, I definitely want Puerto Rico to be independent. :biggrin: Valiz is simply an alternate way to render the name that was the source of "Belize". Originally it was "Wallace", and a few generations of Spanish and creole changed the name.

What's the population of the ASB? With so many borders to cross and no tsunami of English settlers, I get the feeling that these areas are a lot less densely populated than they are in OTL.
Confession: I hate doing numbers. I think that if you were to look at the ASB in 1700 or 1800, the population would absolutely be lower than in OTL. But then you have industrialization, and no small amount of immigration from Europe, something experienced by every country in the Americas. I'm not sure that the population would be terribly different in the 2000s...

Was a world map of the ASB universe ever created? I know this crosses over with another timeline so I was wondering what the world looks like. I'm sure there is a lot of empty spaces still, but seeing the big picture might be cool.
I started a Worlda. Here's where it stands so far... obviously there's a lot that isn't done at all.
worlda asb cropped.png
 
Confession: I hate doing numbers. I think that if you were to look at the ASB in 1700 or 1800, the population would absolutely be lower than in OTL. But then you have industrialization, and no small amount of immigration from Europe, something experienced by every country in the Americas. I'm not sure that the population would be terribly different in the 2000s...
If the population and its distribution aren't that different from OTL in the 2000s, then I might attempt listing the states by population. It sounds like something I'd enjoy.
 
Hey False Dmitri, just wanted to say great job on the maps! They look absolutely fantastic. :)

And a couple thoughts.

Central America is definitely full of placeholders.
If you don't mind me doing so, may I suggest a restored Cuzcatlan in Western El Salvador?

Confession: I hate doing numbers. I think that if you were to look at the ASB in 1700 or 1800, the population would absolutely be lower than in OTL. But then you have industrialization, and no small amount of immigration from Europe, something experienced by every country in the Americas. I'm not sure that the population would be terribly different in the 2000s...
I don't remember where this was said, but didn't you mention that the ASB was poorer or at least had a smaller GDP in comparison to the same area OTL?

If that's the case, combined this with stuff like historically lower population than OTL, a lack of impetus of immigration from places like Mexico, more complex internal border situations, maybe a bigger focus on environmental protection, etc. then I could easily see the ASB being anywhere from 5-15 percent less populous than the OTL area.

Of course, stuff like a delayed demographic transition and less immigration to the OTL western US area from the ASB might also mean that the ASB is more populous than one might otherwise assume...

Admittedly, I don't even know where you would begin in doing the numbers, but the end result would be fascinating to see.
 
Tallest buildings
If fun not allowed, perhaps we can delve into architectural drawing a la Skyscraperpage? Tallest/most prominent man-made structure in each state.
You inspired me a bit. :p Here's a little graphic I made of the five tallest buildings in the ASB; I figure they'd be shorter than IOTL, because of the lack of a gigantic population:


I also started with a Wikipedia-type thing, but didn't get far :p:​
 
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Sternberg

Banned
Well great, now I have even more reason to procrastinate.

Hopes and prayers and crossed fingers with a big, fat, juicy cherry on top that I quit being such a lazy bum and colour the outlines in. The black outlines are a good starting place and allow for simple shapes to be drafted before moving on to the finer details. I love architecture.
 
Well great, now I have even more reason to procrastinate.

Hopes and prayers and crossed fingers with a big, fat, juicy cherry on top that I quit being such a lazy bum and colour the outlines in. The black outlines are a good starting place and allow for simple shapes to be drafted before moving on to the finer details. I love architecture.
I'd love for you to illustrate the shitty outlines I made! :D Maybe you knowing I'm excited to see your work will keep you from procrastinating for too long. p:
 
This page makes me very happy. If it wasn't clear before, now it's easy to see that this world is something way bigger than just me. The fact that you guys are interested enough to contribute your creativity is one of the best compliments I've ever gotten. :)

And the Worlda is beautiful. Its existence is so flattering, Tyche, that I don't even care that we duplicated each other's work. I'll stop work on mine if you'd like to make the rest of the known world (Russia and surrounding countries, mostly). And the buildings, my God! This was a good day.

So Venusian, as long as Cuzcatlan can harmonize with what else is known about the Americas, of course! Now I had not assumed that there was anything left unconquered in Spanish America, beyond the outlying regions that were uncolonized in OTL. But an indigenous aristocracy that persisted into modern times is definitely plausible and fits well within the spirit of this world. There still is a Duke of Montezuma, after all.

On that note, has your general plan for TTL's Mexico ever been posted?

So to Falkanner and Venusian: I was going to say just what Venusian said, that since the ASB is generally less developed in terms of GDP, there's a good chance that its population has risen *faster* in recent years. On the other hand, the insane growth of the 19th century did not happen either, so the overall population count might come out basically even. To explain that further, there are several factors behind that slower development. Expansion and the confiscation of Indian lands produced rapid growth, both economic and demographic, and that was obviously tempered in TTL. That in turn affected the culture; the acquisitiveness that so defined US culture was somewhat less strong; entrepreneurship was not placed on quite so high a pedestal. Finally there are the indigenous states, which I'm sure have had throughout their history greater poverty than their OTL counterparts.

What's different would be the distribution. The slower growth of the 19th century meant that in areas of established settlement, populations were actually denser than they were in OTL. In areas of new settlement, the big family farms that were universal in OTL did not happen everywhere. In many places, village-based agriculture was the norm, with the people living together in a central space and lots more commonly owned land than we had in OTL. All of this has led me to assume that the main urban agglomerations are smaller, the outlying cities bigger, and rural settlement denser in the ASB compared to the United States. On the other hand, urbanization is pretty universal around the world, so most of the big cities probably have some suburban sprawl around them.

Some of those ideas are probably half-formed and poorly worded. But hopefully they clarify more than they obscure.

Thanks again to everyone for adding your ideas to this place!
 
Population
States of the ASB by 2015 Population:
(Assuming OTL distribution)
Code:
1. Upper Country      30,300,000
2. New Netherland     20,100,000
3. Carolina           16,300,000
4. Ohio               12,400,000
5. Cuba               11,200,000
6. West Dominica      10,600,000
7. East Dominica      10,000,000
8. Seminol            9,800,000
9. Huronia            9,400,000
10. Canada            8,400,000
11. Lower Virginia    7,500,000
12. East Florida      7,500,000
13. Upper Virginia    7,000,000
14. Pennsylvania      6,600,000
15. Dakota            6,600,000
16. Lower Louisiana   6,300,000
17. Massachusetts Bay 5,400,000
18. Maryland          5,300,000
19. Illinois          5,000,000
20. Iroquoia          4,600,000
21. Cherokee          4,100,000
22. Muscogia          4,000,000
23. Lower Connecticut 3,800,000
24. Allegheny         3,600,000
25. Upper Connecticut 3,200,000
26. Upper Louisiana   2,700,000
27. New Hampshire     2,600,000
28. Chicasaw          2,600,000
29. Christiana        2,400,000
30. West Florida      2,100,000
31. Assiniboia        1,700,000
32. Poutaxia          1,700,000
33. Arques            1,600,000
34. Watauga           1,400,000
35. Plymouth          1,400,000
36. Saybrook          1,200,000
37. Choctaw           1,000,000
38. Rhode Island      800,000
39. New Scotland      720,000
40. Vermont           600,000
41. West Acadia       570,000
42. Newfoundland      480,000
43. Bahamas           390,000
44. East Acadia       160,000
45. Saint John's I.   140,000
46. Bermuda           95,000
47. Cayman Islands    56,000
48. Vineyards         25,000
49. Labrador          17,000
50. St. P. and Miq.   6,000
TOTAL: 245,459,000

Source: https://www.freemaptools.com/find-population.htm
 
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So what would that make the total population? :p

Also, I'm really happy to be adding what little I can to the world, it's an amazing thing. :)
 
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