A Wet Kalahari

A much less believable point of difference than some but hear me out.

Around 10000 years ago, a geological event occured which pushed Southern Africa (Botswana, South Africa, Namibia and Mozambique) upwards. This coincided with a massive drying of that portion of the continent.

What if this geological event had never occured? Prior to this there were lots of rivers which are now dried up (called Omuramba); if the event had never occured, this rivers would remain, and there would be a traversable river system connecting the major parts of Southern Africa.

At this point in history, the only people living in this part of the world were the Basarwa (also known as the San or !Kung); but around 800AD, the Bantu speaking tribes began to enter as well.

So, does anyone have any thoughts about this?
 

mowque

Banned
At this point in history, the only people living in this part of the world were the Basarwa (also known as the San or !Kung); but around 800AD, the Bantu speaking tribes began to enter as well. ?

I think the modern term is 'Dobe Juǀʼhoansi'
 
I think the modern term is 'Dobe Juǀʼhoansi'

I'm from Botswana, we refer to them as Basarwa but I don't know what they call themselves :/

That would require Alien Space Bats

Well, I've been ghosting this board and I've seen other ideas which required geological changes so, I thought it wouldn't matter much.
 

mowque

Banned
I'm from Botswana, we refer to them as Basarwa but I don't know what they call themselves :/

I happily just studied them in class. But to the question.

I think you'd just see more Bantu dominated area. Unless you get some type of Zulu state arising, he big butterflies (for global consequences) will wait till European settlement. A wet Kalahari changes everything.
 

The Dude

Banned
Well, I've been ghosting this board and I've seen other ideas which required geological changes so, I thought it wouldn't matter much.
All of those WIs with geological changes either were or should have been put in ASB. That said, the butterflies of such a geological change are almost unpredictable.
 
All of those WIs with geological changes either were or should have been put in ASB. That said, the butterflies of such a geological change are almost unpredictable.
Your first sentence follows from your second. Predictive speculation on history is impossible with geologic PODs, because you either have to include a butterfly net (which is ASB) or examine everything that's happened from 100,000 BC on (which is impossible, since we don't have the records, and would be rather boring if we did).
 
A much less believable point of difference than some but hear me out.

Around 10000 years ago, a geological event occured which pushed Southern Africa (Botswana, South Africa, Namibia and Mozambique) upwards. This coincided with a massive drying of that portion of the continent.

What if this geological event had never occured? Prior to this there were lots of rivers which are now dried up (called Omuramba); if the event had never occured, this rivers would remain, and there would be a traversable river system connecting the major parts of Southern Africa.

At this point in history, the only people living in this part of the world were the Basarwa (also known as the San or !Kung); but around 800AD, the Bantu speaking tribes began to enter as well.

So, does anyone have any thoughts about this?

If you want my opinion, call it ASB, and then keep on moving. Do your research do what you want with it, and ignore the nay sayers.
 

NothingNow

Banned
If you want my opinion, call it ASB, and then keep on moving. Do your research do what you want with it, and ignore the nay sayers.
This, one thousand and one times this. We really don't see enough stuff like this really.

That said, it'd be wonderful if we could have a Speculative Biology and Geology board here, but Ian isn't up for putting new boards on.
 
With a PoD that far back you're highly unlikely to get 'Bantus'

The pre-Bantu existed outside of the area of effect, and the event likely would'nt really change anything outside of Southern Africa, so unless it allows some great South African Empire to arise (quickly) and subjugate/extrminate the (pre?) Bantu people the Bantu would exist.


All of those WIs with geological changes either were or should have been put in ASB. That said, the butterflies of such a geological change are almost unpredictable.

No they are'nt.

They're only ASB if the event itself could only happen/be prefented by one.
 
No they are'nt.

They're only ASB if the event itself could only happen/be prefented by one.
The ASB part isn't so much that we're positing a different geological scenario, but that the traditional treatment is to put OTL figures in the long-since ltered world. Earth is a chaotic system, so the chances of none of Sargon's great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-grandparents drowning in an alternate rainstorm or something is impossibly low.
 
Do we have to have this debate every time someone brings up a geologic PoD? They aren't ASB. They can be handled in an ASB way by not factoring in butterflies, but in and of themselves they are not ASB.
 
Around 10000 years ago, a geological event occured which pushed Southern Africa (Botswana, South Africa, Namibia and Mozambique) upwards. This coincided with a massive drying of that portion of the continent.
Coincided with but not Caused by.
The Uplifting was a geological event caused by plate tectonics, the Drying was caused by changes in currents, [polar] associated with the end of the ice age, & sea level rise.
 
The pre-Bantu existed outside of the area of effect, and the event likely would'nt really change anything outside of Southern Africa, so unless it allows some great South African Empire to arise (quickly) and subjugate/extrminate the (pre?) Bantu people the Bantu would exist.
Certainly the ancestors of the Bantu exist - but why on earth would the SAME group of people move in the SAME way (east across Africa, then south). Why not some other group. Starting 10k years ago, I really don't think the 'blacks' who will eventually move into the KhoiSan territory (which I agree IS likely at some point), will resemble OTL's Bantu enough to be worthy of calling them that.
 
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