A lesser Israel

I like to imagine scenarios where there's both an Independent Jewish state (in the Levant) AND peace between it and the neighboring countries. I think that it can't have Jerusalem for that to happen, and as much as it pains me I think it should be limited to what today is known as "Gush Dan", which is a large metropolitan area centered in Tel-Aviv.

I think any more land will inevitably cause major issues, while a small piece of land which is almost a city-state (today with a population of ~ 3.5 million and pretty homogenous in its Jewishness).

I'm just rambling now, but do you think that with good diplomacy such a nation could've existed without Arab-Israeli war? do you think it can have more land? do you think it should have less?
 

samcster94

Banned
I like to imagine scenarios where there's both an Independent Jewish state (in the Levant) AND peace between it and the neighboring countries. I think that it can't have Jerusalem for that to happen, and as much as it pains me I think it should be limited to what today is known as "Gush Dan", which is a large metropolitan area centered in Tel-Aviv.

I think any more land will inevitably cause major issues, while a small piece of land which is almost a city-state (today with a population of ~ 3.5 million and pretty homogenous in its Jewishness).

I'm just rambling now, but do you think that with good diplomacy such a nation could've existed without Arab-Israeli war? do you think it can have more land? do you think it should have less?
Can it be a British Dominion?
 
In order to have the Arabs accept a UN partition plan, you might have to go back to the collapse/disestablishment of the Ottoman Empire. If the Ottoman Empire had been kept in some form after WWI (their bureaucratic management for instance) then maybe there would have been an overarching common voice to have the Arab leaders accept the UN mandate.
 
I like to imagine scenarios where there's both an Independent Jewish state (in the Levant) AND peace between it and the neighboring countries. I think that it can't have Jerusalem for that to happen, and as much as it pains me I think it should be limited to what today is known as "Gush Dan", which is a large metropolitan area centered in Tel-Aviv.

I think any more land will inevitably cause major issues, while a small piece of land which is almost a city-state (today with a population of ~ 3.5 million and pretty homogenous in its Jewishness).

It would needs Jerusalem, firstly because Jerusalem population was majority jewish at that time, and because cutting a territories between ethnic groups presuppose conflict between them.
 
I like to imagine scenarios where there's both an Independent Jewish state (in the Levant) AND peace between it and the neighboring countries. I think that it can't have Jerusalem for that to happen, and as much as it pains me I think it should be limited to what today is known as "Gush Dan", which is a large metropolitan area centered in Tel-Aviv.

I think any more land will inevitably cause major issues, while a small piece of land which is almost a city-state (today with a population of ~ 3.5 million and pretty homogenous in its Jewishness).

I'm just rambling now, but do you think that with good diplomacy such a nation could've existed without Arab-Israeli war? do you think it can have more land? do you think it should have less?

In 1948, there was absolutely no way the Arabs, either the Palestinian Arabs or the surrounding Arab states, would have willingly tolerated the establishment of a Jewish state in any part of the Mandate. They rejected any possible partition, and viewed a Jewish state in any part of Palestine as an injustice. Their demand was consistent: a single state encompassing the entire Mandate and an end to any further Jewish immigration.

Furthermore, Jerusalem had a large Jewish population, and the coastal plain had a Jewish majority, so this would have required a significant population transfer or a large number of Jews living under either Arab or international rule. You could see violent reactions from the Irgun and Lehi. Furthermore, only 3.5 million Israeli Jews today means significantly less Jewish immigration. There is no way trying to limit Jewish immigration would go down well. Such a state would also face far more existential threats in case of war, and would not be as self-sufficient as Israel became.
 
As both sides were committed to the war, I don't think it could have been avoided. But some things after the war might be able to create such a nation....

A. A more effective Jordanian military / Palestinian militias hand the Israelis some serious defeats on West Bank during 1948. IOTL, the Jordanian Army "Arab legion" was the best prepared Arab army and did deliver the sole defeat and a disproportionate number of the few setbacks the Israelis experienced.

B. This even more effective Jordanian Army / Palestinian militia force is backed by a unified Palestinian population. Historically, the Israeli success in 1948 was due in part to the unified Israelis fighting a loose coalition of autonomous Palestinian villages, towns, desert clans, oligarchs and other tribal chieftains. The Israeli command issued orders. Palestinian orders (really just suggestions) were drafted by commitees.
 
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