A Jewish Monarchy in Christian Medieval Europe

[Turkey Braveheart]

Could a Jewish Monarchy have ruled a kingdom in medieval Europe for at least a century any time from 700 to 1400? If so, would it have survived and where could it have come about? Could it have ruled a majority Christian population?

There are none that ruled powerful fiefdoms within other kingdoms during the middle ages but there were times where Jews held bureaucratic power, fought in the army or were famous paramour's of the king. Alfonso VI of Castile's army included 10's of thousands of Jews, Alfonso VIII lover and head of his court was a Jewish woman named Rahel, Norman Sicily boasted Jewish administrators and Ostrogothic Italy's Jews chose to fight with the Goths against the Eastern Roman Empire during the wars of Justinian. Pedro I was nicknamed 'the king of the Jews' for being their beneficiary before he was dethroned and murdered. Casimir III of Poland made Poland the safe haven for Jews from all over Europe.

Could these examples have grown over time into a power base capable of taking the throne or winning independence for a region under their rule?

One caveat: The Khazars do not quite count given that they ruled largely Central Asian territory and most of the tribes in the Khanate were pagan.

 

[Tirion]

Could a Jewish Monarchy have ruled a kingdom in medieval Europe for at least a century any time from 700 to 1400? If so, would it have survived and where could it have come about? Could it have ruled a majority Christian population?

There are none that ruled powerful fiefdoms within other kingdoms during the middle ages but there were times where Jews held bureaucratic power, fought in the army or were famous paramour's of the king. Alfonso VI of Castile's army included 10's of thousands of Jews, Alfonso VIII lover and head of his court was a Jewish woman named Rahel, Norman Sicily boasted Jewish administrators and Ostrogothic Italy's Jews chose to fight with the Goths against the Eastern Roman Empire during the wars of Justinian. Pedro I was nicknamed 'the king of the Jews' for being their beneficiary before he was dethroned and murdered. Casimir III of Poland made Poland the safe haven for Jews from all over Europe.

Could these examples have grown over time into a power base capable of taking the throne or winning independence for a region under their rule?

One caveat: The Khazars do not quite count given that they ruled largely Central Asian territory and most of the tribes in the Khanate were pagan.

Well, just like the Khazars, it could have happened somewhere without a single dominant religion and/or great power, to maintain a nation's independence. And of course somewhere with lots of pagans... converting Christians or Muslims to any other faith always provoked violent and organised retribution. So I guess Hungary in the 900s, slavish states in and around there (today's Czech Republic and Slovakia), and the Vikings would have been likely candidates.

 

[Falastur]

I'm not quite sure how this could ever happen. The chances of a King converting to Judaism are pretty much zero, so that's out. While some Jews did have very successful careers the Jews were on the whole persecuted or at least frowned on and ignored, so they aren't going to be given a territory. For that matter, there are virtually no examples in European history of ethnic groups "being given a Kingdom" anyway, so even if the Jews were viewed as some kind of super-men, we shouldn't expect any kind of land grant because land grants just didn't happen. I can't see a Jewish rebellion for independence succeeding either - not least because the Jewish population in Europe was by and large very spread out and while you might have a few thousand in one city, there wasn't anywhere with a big enough community to be the majority ethnicity anywhere, and any attempt at a rebellion for independence would by nature force the local Christian population to fight them too, so that's out.

Virtually the only thing I can think of is a Jew being made a noble in one Kingdom or another because of a history of devoted loyalty and service to a King, and managing to retain their faith in spite of waves of anti-Semitism which came and went in Europe, and in spite of the way that any Jew elevated to the peerage will be cut off from their religious brethren, meaning they may over the course of generations feel pressured to convert to Catholicism to fit in with their peers at court. Also you'd bet there would be no Jewish women of their class around, so they would have to marry their children to Catholic women, furthering the chance of their Judaism being weakened or falling. Thus, this in itself is pretty unlikely. This noble's descendants, far down the line, could then take advantage of their country falling apart for non-specific reasons to declare independence. This is even more unlikely as such independence moves were very rare, but hey, it's an idea. Being Jewish they would then be free to practise their faith openly, though they would surely rule a Christian population and would have to be very, very favourable to Christianity to the point of being half-Christian to avoid constant religious riots, not to mention that other Christian neighbouring Kings would likely attack them, labelling them as heretics and an abomination to Christendom.

The number of fluke coincidences to make this work would be high, thus it's a very, very unlikely scenario. But it's the best I can do.

 

[RGB]

The pork prohibition, though perhaps a very old saw, is a major problem in northern states. I'm actually thinking of maybe smallish states in Occitania or Spain, where a Jewish prince could rule for a while.

Likely such a state would be ephemeral, but we are dealing with the possible, after all.

 

[Prem_Rack]

Chazars were Jewish, and according to Chronicles the Russian Prince considered converting to either Islam, Judaism, Western- or Eastern- Christianity before choosing the last one. So it's a possibility.
However, if by "Europe" you mean Catholic Western Europe....Unpossible.

 

[Philip]

I think it is conceivable with an early POD, probably around the fall of the Western Empire. Of course, you'd probably end up with very different Europe.

 

[MNP]

Ibn Nagrallah basically ran Zirid Granada as he liked there for a while.

Other than that, I think your best bet is something someone who wrote a Khazar timeline suggested and that would be a small Jewish principality or maybe a few of them, in the northern Caucasus mountains after the fall of the Khazars. I'm not sure if they would be kings, but they might actually run their states.

 

[Turkey Braveheart]

The ideas I like the best so far:
Around 800 a pagan nation in Eastern Europe converts to Judaism because of Khazar influence and manages to survive their collapse. The Magyars are a good candidate and being both militarily strong and surrounded by Pagans who don't care to fight over religion could keep them secure.

A pro-Jewish Christian king in Spain during the reconquista, in recognition of their support against the Moors, grants the Jews a County or Dukedom carved from newly won territory. Jews flock there, giving it a high enough concentration to be considered a 'Jewish country'. During the frequent devisions following the death a powerful king, this fief breaks away and a Jewish king is crowned. It survives for hundreds of years by swearing allegiance to Christian or Moorish leaders depending on their needs.

 

[MNP]

^Not so much swearing allegiance as handing over massive amounts of tribute. Tribute would do it.

 

[HeavyWeaponsGuy]

Maaaybe with a more tolerant Spanish monarchy than OTL and some sort of strong effort on the part of Jewish soldiers and/or nobility (not that there were many of the latter) there could be some sort of minute amount of land ceded south of Asturias to the Jews on the behest of this hypothetical Jewish noble who was a respected and loyal servant of the Spanish throne (or what passed for European Spain at the time anyway).

Showing a loyal servant can be rewarded? Check.

Using the servant's request to fulfill a cynical and self-motivated desire to have a buffer between Asturias and Moorish Al-Andalus? Check.

Long-term survivability, especially post-Reconquista when the Spaniards are going to be focusing more on consolidation and politics than on the Muslims? That's where we have some problems. It'd have to be out of the way and viewed as not worth Spain's time to conquer, especially if it wound up being a sort of medieval Israel that attracted Jews from Europe, the migrants would have trouble but it's not like every kingdom in Europe is going to fight to keep them.

Also, this idea is COOL.

 

[HeavyWeaponsGuy]

The ideas I like the best so far:
Around 800 a pagan nation in Eastern Europe converts to Judaism because of Khazar influence and manages to survive their collapse. The Magyars are a good candidate and being both militarily strong and surrounded by Pagans who don't care to fight over religion could keep them secure.

A pro-Jewish Christian king in Spain during the reconquista, in recognition of their support against the Moors, grants the Jews a County or Dukedom carved from newly won territory. Jews flock there, giving it a high enough concentration to be considered a 'Jewish country'. During the frequent devisions following the death a powerful king, this fief breaks away and a Jewish king is crowned. It survives for hundreds of years by swearing allegiance to Christian or Moorish leaders depending on their needs.

Yeah! Like my post where they're made by a pro-Jewish king albeit one with cynical motives to use them as a buffer state so that if they come to blows with the Moors than the worst fighting happens at that crossroads Jewish kingdom.

 

[Falastur]

Maaaybe with a more tolerant Spanish monarchy than OTL and some sort of strong effort on the part of Jewish soldiers and/or nobility (not that there were many of the latter) there could be some sort of minute amount of land ceded south of Asturias to the Jews on the behest of this hypothetical Jewish noble who was a respected and loyal servant of the Spanish throne (or what passed for European Spain at the time anyway).

I can't think of a time when land was ceded to be an independent state - even as a buffer state - though. It would be entirely without precedent, and completely against the mindset of people in that day. Independent buffer states just didn't exist. You might set up one of your vassals as a marcher lord with a mandate specifically to guard the frontier, but an independent buffer? Didn't happen. As far as people were concerned in this era, the advantages of not having to guard your border were entirely negated by the disadvantages of not controlling that land personally. Maybe it was something to do with the way that lords, once given a sniff of independence, tended to turn on their former masters. Also it might be to do with the way that setting up an independent buffer would be viewed by the rest of Christendom as a sign of your own weakness. Either way, I'm just not convinced it would happen.

 

[HeavyWeaponsGuy]

I can't think of a time when land was ceded to be an independent state - even as a buffer state - though. It would be entirely without precedent, and completely against the mindset of people in that day. Independent buffer states just didn't exist. You might set up one of your vassals as a marcher lord with a mandate specifically to guard the frontier, but an independent buffer? Didn't happen. As far as people were concerned in this era, the advantages of not having to guard your border were entirely negated by the disadvantages of not controlling that land personally. Maybe it was something to do with the way that lords, once given a sniff of independence, tended to turn on their former masters. Also it might be to do with the way that setting up an independent buffer would be viewed by the rest of Christendom as a sign of your own weakness. Either way, I'm just not convinced it would happen.

Ah, a march then, totally my bad I should've been more careful with the time period. So a slower journey towards Jewish independence then. Marches did involve to some extent a cessation of the authority of the central monarch to that of the march and that implies to some level a bit more free-form in terms of governance and practices. I can see it leading to a slightly more autonomous outlook for the region and its people, and slowly but surely leading to inklings of wanting to be an independent kingdom over a long period of time. Especially if various Spanish nobles look the other way as Jews slowly leave portions of Spain for an area that is actually ruled by one of them.

 

[Turkey Braveheart]

I can't think of a time when land was ceded to be an independent state - even as a buffer state - though. It would be entirely without precedent, and completely against the mindset of people in that day. Independent buffer states just didn't exist. You might set up one of your vassals as a marcher lord with a mandate specifically to guard the frontier, but an independent buffer? Didn't happen. As far as people were concerned in this era, the advantages of not having to guard your border were entirely negated by the disadvantages of not controlling that land personally. Maybe it was something to do with the way that lords, once given a sniff of independence, tended to turn on their former masters. Also it might be to do with the way that setting up an independent buffer would be viewed by the rest of Christendom as a sign of your own weakness. Either way, I'm just not convinced it would happen.

The Romans conquered Mesopotamia under Trajan. Feeling that they had overextended themselves they later left the area, ceding land to local kings. Flavius Stilicho intended to save the Western Empire in the 400's by ceding land in Gaul to the Goths on the condition that they bolster the Empire's failing defenses. He was murdered by the Emperor before it could take place, but it had the capability to save the West.

It's rare, but it has happened.

 

[HeavyWeaponsGuy]

The Romans conquered Mesopotamia under Trajan. Feeling that they had overextended themselves they later left the area, ceding land to local kings. Flavius Stilicho intended to save the Western Empire in the 400's by ceding land in Gaul to the Goths on the condition that they bolster the Empire's failing defenses. He was murdered by the Emperor before it could take place, but it had the capability to save the West.

It's rare, but it has happened.

Yeah, the thing about precedent is, pragmatism existed as well and sometimes people were just the types to go outside the box.

If Henry VIII's completely throwing out the Catholic church as the royal religion and starting his own church had not happened, it would be completely decried as counterfactual today, sometimes life is crazy that way.

 

[CaliBoy1990]

Could a Jewish Monarchy have ruled a kingdom in medieval Europe for at least a century any time from 700 to 1400? If so, would it have survived and where could it have come about? Could it have ruled a majority Christian population?

There are none that ruled powerful fiefdoms within other kingdoms during the middle ages but there were times where Jews held bureaucratic power, fought in the army or were famous paramour's of the king. Alfonso VI of Castile's army included 10's of thousands of Jews, Alfonso VIII lover and head of his court was a Jewish woman named Rahel, Norman Sicily boasted Jewish administrators and Ostrogothic Italy's Jews chose to fight with the Goths against the Eastern Roman Empire during the wars of Justinian. Pedro I was nicknamed 'the king of the Jews' for being their beneficiary before he was dethroned and murdered. Casimir III of Poland made Poland the safe haven for Jews from all over Europe.

Could these examples have grown over time into a power base capable of taking the throne or winning independence for a region under their rule?

One caveat: The Khazars do not quite count given that they ruled largely Central Asian territory and most of the tribes in the Khanate were pagan.

Northern Prussia, Schleswig, Jutland or bust.

 

[Falastur]

The Romans conquered Mesopotamia under Trajan. Feeling that they had overextended themselves they later left the area, ceding land to local kings. Flavius Stilicho intended to save the Western Empire in the 400's by ceding land in Gaul to the Goths on the condition that they bolster the Empire's failing defenses. He was murdered by the Emperor before it could take place, but it had the capability to save the West.

It's rare, but it has happened.

Irrelevant IMO. The way Roman society and politics worked was massively different to how Christian medieval/Dark Ages politics worked. You can't use an example from the Roman era as a precedent for how a Christian kingdom would operate because they held themselves to totally different standards and had totally different attitudes and logical reasoning.

 

[Turkey Braveheart]

Irrelevant IMO. The way Roman society and politics worked was massively different to how Christian medieval/Dark Ages politics worked. You can't use an example from the Roman era as a precedent for how a Christian kingdom would operate because they held themselves to totally different standards and had totally different attitudes and logical reasoning.

Not so different, especially in light of the fact that the Eastern Empire survived as a state big enough to have included kingdoms until the 1100's.

And Stilicho was Christian, like the rest of the Western Empire.

 

[Elfwine]

The Eastern Empire is still not something like how the rest of Europe worked, though, and its buffer states involved already existing native rulers.

 

[carlton_bach]

It would have to be early, certainly pre-Lateran Councils. And it is hard to see. but it may be possible. My idea would be a kingdom in the Western Slavic regions, around the 8th/9th century. Ethnogenesis was still incomplete, so an identity could be built around a king. And the concept of kingship was still malleable, too. A Jewish expatriate from the Carolingian state or the Islamic world might be successful in ruling a Western Slavic kingdom, much as the legendary Samo may have (who the expletive deleted really knows, honestly). It is very unlikely he would succeed at converting it, though.