A independent nation in the Americas before the US?

It just suddenly came into my mind yesterday, but was there any events or possibilities that there could of been an independent country in the Americas before the American Revolution.

By independent nation I mean as a European colony that goes independent, should of stated that but I didn't want the title to be very long.
 
Have Jacob Leisler somehow win the backing of the Dutch Reformed Church and turn his insurrection into a popular New Yorker(Netherlander) revolt against Britain. Instead of rebelling against colonial authorities, it's open rebellion against British rule and such New York temporarily becomes an independent state before likely being reconquered by colonial forces from the South and New England.
 
I've toyed with the idea of New England going independent when Charles II was restored to the English throne, but they weren't quite ready for independence at that point. Not enough people or industry to stand on their own.

Another possibility: If the king had won the English civil war against parliament, you might have seen enough of his opponents flee to New England to make an independent Puritan state there. New England was very pro-Parliament. The question would be whether the colonies could integrate enough people to be viable that early. Probably not.

Another option: Independent conquistador kingdoms. The last of the Pizarro brothers revolted against Spain in the 1540s, after a Spanish decree that reduced the power of conquistadors over the Indians that served them. The rebels controlled Peru for a few years as I recall it. There probably would have been a similar revolt in Mexico, but the Spanish Viceroy there wisely decided to hold off on implementing the changes. If he had been less politically adept, you might have seen both Mexico and Peru in revolt, which would have been considerably more serious for Spain and might have led to longer-term independence for those colonies. That's not the way to bet, though, because the colonies were too vital to Spain, because of the gold and silver. They would have put enormous effort into getting them back. It would have taken another European country intervening or some other threat keeping Spain distracted to keep them from doing whatever it took to retake those colonies. France would be most likely to intervene, but had no bases in the Americas close enough to help and would have had to penetrate a Caribbean dominated by Spain to do anything. An upsurge in the Turkish threat might be an option. I would have to look at what France and Turkey were up to at the time. England, as I recall, was tacitly allied with Spain against France at this time.

Yet another option: A French Huguenot (Protestant) state. In the 1560s, French Huguenots tried settlements in Brazil and in Florida. Both failed, the Florida one due to a Spanish expedition massacring the settlers. Let's say that the French tried in the Chesapeake Bay area instead of Florida, further from Spanish power and less threatening to the Spanish treasure convoys going between Cuba and Florida. They would find small tribes rather than the unified group under Powhatan. Let's say they succeed in founding a French Virginia in the 1560s, which expands rapidly as French Wars of religion drive out French Protestants and many of those refugees end up in the French Virginia colony. By the 1590's, there is a large, flourishing French Huguenot population radiating out from Virginia. Of course that means no Jamestown and a whole slew of other changes that would make US history unrecognizable, but it could easily lead to an independent European state in the Americas long before the American revolution.
 
Would an indpendent surviving Vinland count? Norway didn't really have the power projection at the time to assert authority over Vinalnd so any surviving Vinland would be de facto independent.
 
Could the Peten basin in Guatemala have held out from Spanish conquest (I mean they survived independent until 1697)? Perhaps change the circumstances or timing of conquest of the Yucatan and have some external trading partner with the audacity to muscle their way into Guatemala (cough cough Britain). I mean, 1638 was when english and scottish settlers started to show up there, so there is some space for a consolidated Protectorate of Peten which retains a degree of independence right up to the revolutions, then becoming fully free again
 
The thread title immediately made me think Native Americans, in which case the Mayan Itza of Peten, the Inca enclave of Vilcabamba, the rebellions of Tupac Amaru II and Tupac Katari, the Pueblo rebellion of Popay in New Mexico, and the Miskito Kingdom are all possibilities, but since the thread specifically asks for European colonies...

1. The Knights of St. John had a short adventure in the Caribbean, governing over four islands. As the only European territory they held at the time was Malta, is it possible that with more success in the Caribbean and less success in Europe, the Caribbean territories might become their main base of operations?

2. Quilombo do Palmares almost fills this role already. It just didn't last. Could it be more successful?

3. Greenland technically existed as an independent country in its earliest days as a Norse settlement...
 
It just suddenly came into my mind yesterday, but was there any events or possibilities that there could of been an independent country in the Americas before the American Revolution.

By independent nation I mean as a European colony that goes independent, should of stated that but I didn't want the title to be very long.
A prominent conquistador (e.g. Cortes) rebels and become independent.
 

BlondieBC

Banned
I've toyed with the idea of New England going independent when Charles II was restored to the English throne, but they weren't quite ready for independence at that point. Not enough people or industry to stand on their own.

Another possibility: If the king had won the English civil war against parliament, you might have seen enough of his opponents flee to New England to make an independent Puritan state there. New England was very pro-Parliament. The question would be whether the colonies could integrate enough people to be viable that early. Probably not.

Another option: Independent conquistador kingdoms. The last of the Pizarro brothers revolted against Spain in the 1540s, after a Spanish decree that reduced the power of conquistadors over the Indians that served them. The rebels controlled Peru for a few years as I recall it. There probably would have been a similar revolt in Mexico, but the Spanish Viceroy there wisely decided to hold off on implementing the changes. If he had been less politically adept, you might have seen both Mexico and Peru in revolt, which would have been considerably more serious for Spain and might have led to longer-term independence for those colonies. That's not the way to bet, though, because the colonies were too vital to Spain, because of the gold and silver. They would have put enormous effort into getting them back. It would have taken another European country intervening or some other threat keeping Spain distracted to keep them from doing whatever it took to retake those colonies. France would be most likely to intervene, but had no bases in the Americas close enough to help and would have had to penetrate a Caribbean dominated by Spain to do anything. An upsurge in the Turkish threat might be an option. I would have to look at what France and Turkey were up to at the time. England, as I recall, was tacitly allied with Spain against France at this time.

On the English Civil War, that one looks easier to me. Have Charles II win and implement a policy of ethic cleansing of the rebels. Charles II see a secure throne by simply allowing/pressuring his rivals to retreat to New World. Five to Ten years of heavy migration to New England should be enough. If say 15% of the British Merchant long-distant merchant marine moves refugees, how many can they move per year?

On the Spanish one, I think I can do it with a simple POD. We need a event similar to the War of Spanish Succession about 1540. So the Pizarro brother revolt. The King of Spain dies, and there is no clear successor. Europe is spends about 5 years deciding who is in charge. The Viceroy of Mexico takes the chances to make himself King of Mexico, rightful heir to the Spanish Throne. Both Peru and Mexico get 5 plus years to get organized and armed. After the main war, a greatly weakened and bankrupt Spain fails in a half-hearted effort to retake Mexico. Then 20 years of peace. After a full generation, it seems strange to think a European power can also rule an empire on the other side of the world.

Maybe also throw in heavy net European migration to Mexico to boost population and education levels.
 

Kaze

Banned
Would the Republic of Pirates count in Nassau and the Bahamas? They declared Independence, got their ass kicked, and returned to the British Empire.

----
I would actually go with the other option with the English Civil War - some cousin of the King realizes that, "If they just killed Charles, I could be next. I am taking my men to some place like New Jersey, Maryland, or some other place - declare myself "Duke" and rule it with an iron fist".
 
Top