A Hippie in the House of Mouse (Jim Henson at Disney, 1980)
- Thread starter Geekhis Khan
- Start date
- Status
Partnered with Sean Connery. "A big fan of the Dragon Ballsh, eh, Trebek?"Dibs on Alex Trebek as host!
My god. I have no words on this sort of pairing.
Still, I'm a bit excited about what the 90s could bring for both cartoons and anime with CTV, Disney Channel, and more anime. It's a good decade to be a geek/otaku!
Since it's 88, I think we should look at how Splash Mountain would turn out in this timeline before the year passes, since I think it's probably inevitable that it's going to be built by Tony Baxter and the rest of the I-Works next year. Even with the controversial theming OTL, it solved three major issues with the desire of a log flume ride from Dick Nunis, a way to revitalize both Disneyland and Bear Country, and to reuse the animatronics from America Sings! as a way to save cost, so it would be very hard to butterfly this ride. In fact, Disney might be even more enthusiastic to make Splash Mountain to capitalize on a newly done Song of the South remake ironically due to Jim Henson, easily integrating the live-action characters of Uncle Remus and Aunt Nancy with the ones from OTL.
I chuckle a little bit that the progressive Jim Henson might be the savior of a ride so wrapped in controversy and racism in our timeline, but he and Tony Baxter could seriously make a more authentic version of Splash Mountain to its Song of the South roots while making it almost timeless for American audiences, which would've been impossible to do under Eisner. It'd actually be really beautiful when you think about it.
Maybe it'll be called Zip-A-dee River Run like what the Imagineers had originally imagined, but I prefer Splash Mountain in my opinion. Maybe some Disney exec like Dick, Wells, or Henson recommends it not as a cringy promo for a rom-com film but because it would fit major attractions like Space Mountain or Big Thunder Mountain Railroad.
Also please please please I hope Disney avoids doing the horrible commercials that they did for Splash Mountain. They should be able to do smarter commercials that make it exciting for both teens and families under the Round Table instead of the horrible fusion that they did with 80s teens culture and Southern folk songs....god it's just so bad.....
Last edited:
Oh yeah, maybe as a kind of AI/robotic scholar.Dibs on Alex Trebek as host!
TBH, even with the improved SotS we get here, I honestly wish Splash Mountain doesn't show up. Just do.
Although that would mean Jess Harnell would probably not have the same career, since SM was his first high profile job in the industries.
Last edited:
Probably too late to butterfly given how far it's been into development (since at least 83 IIRC) and the immense benefits that the theme park gets in both general attendance and reviving the aging Bear Country.
If there's anyone to blame for the creation of Splash Mountain, it's squarely on Tony Baxter and Dick Nunis.
This actually inspired in me a way to save Tomorrowland in fashion similar to what they did in Euro Disney OTL: 1930/40s retro sci-fi.
I believe that's what they did for New Tomorrowland in the Magic Kingdom. Euro Disneyland / Disneyland Paris went with the 1800s/early 1900s sci-fi with Discoveryland.
But yeah, Star Tours, Transformers, and other franchises can be used to bring in new visitors alongside a refurbishment on the same level as New Tomorrowland or Tomorrowland 2055. Valencia will be a huge factor on the how much they will change Tomorrowland from the ground up though.
Last edited:
CG isn't exactly at that level in the late 80s nor is Jason DeMarco around so no CGI RoboAlex
With the existence of the CHERNOBOG supercomputer I think the CG technology will advance at a faster pace than OTL.
But no based Litch King means the bumps will have to rely more on a practical setpiece... At least at first.
Last edited:
Actually, The Pink Panther films, as well as the cartoon shorts were co-produced and released by United Artists, and ITTL, are currently owned by Tracinda. There's a good chance though that Tom and Jerry, Droopy and Barney Bear (and maybe even Red Hot Riding Hood) might show up in MickeyQuest if Disney and Turner/Columbia partner on it (If the MGM theatrical cartoon shorts are included in the pre-'85/'86 IP...).
Who Posted Roger Rabbit
Hangin’ with Roger Rabbit
From The Today Show, January 11th, 1988.
Title Card: “The Today Show”
Theme song plays as the Title Card displays. Title card fades to…
Interior – Today Show Set
Jane Pauley and Bryant Gumbel sit alongside Jim Henson, Terry Gilliam, and a Roger Rabbit walkaround. Paul Reubens is off camera, providing voiceover for Roger Rabbit.
The Jessica Rabbit Walkaround is not nearly this creepy in this timeline (Image source “imnotbad.com”)
Exterior – Street Outside of the Today Show Set
Willard Scott stands by a group of excited, cheering fans. He smiles and waves. Statler peeks in from the left side of the screen and frowns. Theme song plays as the Title Card displays. Fade to commercial.
[1] Just as Roger’s look is informed by a combination of WB and Disney animation styles, Roger’s laugh in this timeline is a combination of Woody Woodpecker and Goofy.
[2] Tim Curry as Judge Doom will indeed be nightmare fuel, though he’s more like his appearance in Muppet Treasure Island than his appearance in It. This is a family movie.
[3] Will be a hit largely due to the clever characters, witty dialog, and crossover from so many different animation studios, but won’t be quite the massive breakout hit that it was in our timeline due to lacking some of the je ne se quoi of the OTL feature, which was lightning in a bottle, and having some of Gilliam’s quirkiness and pacing problems limit the mass appeal (fewer re-viewings). Eventually this timeline’s version will make over $200 million worldwide against a $50 million budget (even more on video) , which is notably less than in our timeline ($300 million+) but still a certifiable blockbuster.
[4] Or more accurately wouldn’t; Ron Miller wasn’t big on public appearances.
[5] Figuratively had to dispatch Sweetums in some cases.
[6] Unlike our timeline’s Richard Williams-animated characters, which took advantage of his singular genius in making 2D look 3D, the Disney Team has relied on the DATA machines to keep 3D proportions going.
[7] Take time to appreciate the fact that Jim is performing two Muppets right now.
[8] An interesting coincidence!
From The Today Show, January 11th, 1988.
Title Card: “The Today Show”
Theme song plays as the Title Card displays. Title card fades to…
Interior – Today Show Set
Jane Pauley and Bryant Gumbel sit alongside Jim Henson, Terry Gilliam, and a Roger Rabbit walkaround. Paul Reubens is off camera, providing voiceover for Roger Rabbit.
The Jessica Rabbit Walkaround is not nearly this creepy in this timeline (Image source “imnotbad.com”)
Jane
Welcome back, everyone, today we have some very special guests, visiting us from Toon Town and Disneyland.
Bryant
Yes, it’s the creators and star of the new hit movie Who Framed Roger Rabbit, in theaters now. Please say hello to Disney Chief Creative Officer and Studio President Jim Henson, director Terry Gilliam, and, of course, the star of the show, Roger Rabbit!
Roger (Paul Reubens V.O.)
Th-th-th-thanks, Bryant! (laughs[1]) It’s an honor to be here!
Jane
So, Roger, tell us about your new movie.
Roger
W-well, Jane, it’s one-part mystery, one-part comedy, one-part live action adventure, and one-part cartoon all shaken over pure fun! (laughs) I had a b-b-blast working on it along with my lovely wife Jessica, my friend Huey, and of course my new friend Ed Harris, who plays Eddie Valiant! I also had a great time with Mr. Tim Curry, who plays the reaaaaalllly scary Judge Doom!
Bryant
So, Tim Curry[2]…not as scary in person, I assume?
Roger
Are you kidding? Thp-p-p-p- He’s a teddy bear! But don’t tell him I told you so! (laughs)
Bryant
And what about Paul Reubens of Pee Wee Herman fame? I hear that he plays a role in this movie.
Roger
R-Reubens? Never met him, W-w-w-which is all the better. That guy c-c-creeps me out! (all laugh)
Jane
Who Framed Roger Rabbit has been a big hit, selling out theaters for three straight weeks[3]. And we also have with us the man who brought us Who Framed Roger Rabbit, Jim Henson.
Jim
Well, thank you, Jane, but I’d be remiss not to give credit where credit is due. The real champion behind Roger Rabbit is my friend CEO Ron Miller, who alas couldn’t[4] be here today. When the original book got published years ago, Ron had the foresight to secure the movie rights. The success of the picture is a credit to his vision.
Jane
As humble as ever, Mr. Henson. Of course, bringing Ron Miller’s original vision to life is director Terry Gilliam. Mr. Gilliam, can you tell us about making Who Framed Roger Rabbit?
Terry
I’ll tell you up front that without Jim I wouldn’t be here! (laughs) When he and Tom Wilhite approached me about directing this I said “no…expletive deleted way!” (all laugh) Directing live action and animation together? No way. Pure laziness on my part. But Jim kept hounding me. And after giving me a chance to make The Bureau and later Munchausen I was hardly going to say no.
Jim
I sent Sweetums to his house to make an offer he couldn’t refuse! (all laugh)
Bryant
So, in addition to the classic Disney cartoon characters like Mickey and Donald, you managed to bring in other beloved characters, from the Warner Brothers Loony Toons characters like Bugs & Daffy to Betty Boop and the Tex Avery classics.
Jane
There are also cameo appearances by classic puppets like Charlie McCarthy and Mortimer Sneed, and not to forget and Kukla, Fran, and Ollie.
Bryant
There’s even an appearance by a young Statler and Waldorf! (laughs)
Jim
Um, yes, we wanted to make this a salute to the Golden Age of Animation, and rather than hog the spotlight for ourselves we invited our sister studios to join us. Writers Jeff Price and Pete Seaman had that idea and Ron and I thought it was excellent. Steve Spielberg helped us convince[5] the other studios to go along.
Jane
And the audiences are loving it.
Roger
It was certainly a d-d-dream come true for me! Mickey and Bugs are my p-p-p-personal heroes, you know!
Jane
Mr. Gilliam, what can you tell us about the experience working with ‘Toons like Roger?
Terry
It was a real challenge to be sure. I’d of course worked a lot with various effects and animations in the past, including my own. I literally die drawing the effects in Search for the Holy Grail. (laughs) Mixing the live with the animated requires a lot of careful preparation. Keeping the eyelines is critical. If Eddie is looking Roger right in the eyes then you need to make sure that when the animators and effects team draw and edit in Roger that he and Eddie are making eye contact in a realistic way the whole time. Keeping the eye lines going was very frustrating at times and we often had to resort to computerized framing[6]. Part of me wishes I’d told Jim ‘no’! (laughs)
Bryant
(close up on Bryant) Now, other than Statler and Waldorf, there were no Muppet appearances. However, we asked one of the Muppets to join us today to talk about it. (cuts back to show everyone; now with Kermit on Jim Henson’s arm) Everyone please welcome Kermit the Frog (applause) So, Kermit, what did you think of the movie?
(Image source “nydailynews.com”)
Jim (as Kermit)
Well, um, Bryant, I rather enjoyed it, you see. As a young tadpole growing up in the swamp, I watched Mickey and Bugs like everyone else, so, um, it was a real joy for me to see them both together.
Bryant
Certainly. But you didn’t make an appearance.
Jim/Kermit
Gosh, Bryant, how old do you think I am? (audience laughs) (close up on Kermit) The movie is set in the late 1940s, and I really didn’t lose my tail until the ‘50s. But a couple of my usual Muppet Show guests were there. (cuts back to wide shot to reveal Statler and Waldorf sitting on the back of the couch; audience applauds)
Jim/Waldorf
Yes, I remember those days like they were yesterday…[7]
Richard Hunt/Statler
For you they were, you forgetful old fool! (laughs, Waldorf makes a face)
Roger
Gosh, yes, I r-r-remember you two! You didn’t t-t-treat my friends Donald and Daffy very nice!
Jim/Waldorf
What can I say, we weren’t very nice in our younger days.
Richard/Statler
And we aren’t very nice now! (both laugh)
Jim/Kermit
Good Grief.
Jane
Mr. Statler, Mr. Waldorf, what did you think of the movie?
Jim/Waldorf
Terrible!
Richard/Statler
Awful!
Jim/Waldorf
Miserable!
Richard/Statler
Dreadful!
Jim/Waldorf
Except for those two handsome young hecklers in the early second act!
Richard/Statler
Yes! More of those guys! (Statler and Waldorf laugh)
Bryant
(close up; laughing) Ladies and gentlemen, Statler and Waldorf! (applause)
Jim/Kermit
(cuts back to wide shot, only Kermit is there, Muppet-wise) Good grief, I have no idea why I keep letting those guys into the theater. They don’t even pay for their seats!
Jane
So, Mr. Gilliam, you have a new feature entering production with Fantasia Films, correct?
Terry
Yes, it’s called the Adventures of Baron von Munchhausen and it’s the third movie of my Trilogy of the Imagination along with Time Bandits, which was about childhood, and The Bureau, which is about adulthood. Baron von Munchausen is about old age. It’s produced by Bernie Brillstein, which, it turns out, has a special connection to the title character. His Uncle Jack, who inspired him to go into entertainment, used to play Baron von Munchausen on the radio[8].
Jim
Bernie was very excited to hear about the movie. He practically begged us to let him produce it.
Roger
Are there any p-p-p-parts for me?
Terry
Not for you, Harvey. (laughter)
Jane
(laughing) Well, with that we need to take a quick commercial break.
Bryant
Thank you, Roger, Jim, Terry, and Kermit! Coming up after the commercial break, we talk as always to my good friend Willard Scott. Hi Willard!
Welcome back, everyone, today we have some very special guests, visiting us from Toon Town and Disneyland.
Bryant
Yes, it’s the creators and star of the new hit movie Who Framed Roger Rabbit, in theaters now. Please say hello to Disney Chief Creative Officer and Studio President Jim Henson, director Terry Gilliam, and, of course, the star of the show, Roger Rabbit!
Roger (Paul Reubens V.O.)
Th-th-th-thanks, Bryant! (laughs[1]) It’s an honor to be here!
Jane
So, Roger, tell us about your new movie.
Roger
W-well, Jane, it’s one-part mystery, one-part comedy, one-part live action adventure, and one-part cartoon all shaken over pure fun! (laughs) I had a b-b-blast working on it along with my lovely wife Jessica, my friend Huey, and of course my new friend Ed Harris, who plays Eddie Valiant! I also had a great time with Mr. Tim Curry, who plays the reaaaaalllly scary Judge Doom!
Bryant
So, Tim Curry[2]…not as scary in person, I assume?
Roger
Are you kidding? Thp-p-p-p- He’s a teddy bear! But don’t tell him I told you so! (laughs)
Bryant
And what about Paul Reubens of Pee Wee Herman fame? I hear that he plays a role in this movie.
Roger
R-Reubens? Never met him, W-w-w-which is all the better. That guy c-c-creeps me out! (all laugh)
Jane
Who Framed Roger Rabbit has been a big hit, selling out theaters for three straight weeks[3]. And we also have with us the man who brought us Who Framed Roger Rabbit, Jim Henson.
Jim
Well, thank you, Jane, but I’d be remiss not to give credit where credit is due. The real champion behind Roger Rabbit is my friend CEO Ron Miller, who alas couldn’t[4] be here today. When the original book got published years ago, Ron had the foresight to secure the movie rights. The success of the picture is a credit to his vision.
Jane
As humble as ever, Mr. Henson. Of course, bringing Ron Miller’s original vision to life is director Terry Gilliam. Mr. Gilliam, can you tell us about making Who Framed Roger Rabbit?
Terry
I’ll tell you up front that without Jim I wouldn’t be here! (laughs) When he and Tom Wilhite approached me about directing this I said “no…expletive deleted way!” (all laugh) Directing live action and animation together? No way. Pure laziness on my part. But Jim kept hounding me. And after giving me a chance to make The Bureau and later Munchausen I was hardly going to say no.
Jim
I sent Sweetums to his house to make an offer he couldn’t refuse! (all laugh)
Bryant
So, in addition to the classic Disney cartoon characters like Mickey and Donald, you managed to bring in other beloved characters, from the Warner Brothers Loony Toons characters like Bugs & Daffy to Betty Boop and the Tex Avery classics.
Jane
There are also cameo appearances by classic puppets like Charlie McCarthy and Mortimer Sneed, and not to forget and Kukla, Fran, and Ollie.
Bryant
There’s even an appearance by a young Statler and Waldorf! (laughs)
Jim
Um, yes, we wanted to make this a salute to the Golden Age of Animation, and rather than hog the spotlight for ourselves we invited our sister studios to join us. Writers Jeff Price and Pete Seaman had that idea and Ron and I thought it was excellent. Steve Spielberg helped us convince[5] the other studios to go along.
Jane
And the audiences are loving it.
Roger
It was certainly a d-d-dream come true for me! Mickey and Bugs are my p-p-p-personal heroes, you know!
Jane
Mr. Gilliam, what can you tell us about the experience working with ‘Toons like Roger?
Terry
It was a real challenge to be sure. I’d of course worked a lot with various effects and animations in the past, including my own. I literally die drawing the effects in Search for the Holy Grail. (laughs) Mixing the live with the animated requires a lot of careful preparation. Keeping the eyelines is critical. If Eddie is looking Roger right in the eyes then you need to make sure that when the animators and effects team draw and edit in Roger that he and Eddie are making eye contact in a realistic way the whole time. Keeping the eye lines going was very frustrating at times and we often had to resort to computerized framing[6]. Part of me wishes I’d told Jim ‘no’! (laughs)
Bryant
(close up on Bryant) Now, other than Statler and Waldorf, there were no Muppet appearances. However, we asked one of the Muppets to join us today to talk about it. (cuts back to show everyone; now with Kermit on Jim Henson’s arm) Everyone please welcome Kermit the Frog (applause) So, Kermit, what did you think of the movie?
(Image source “nydailynews.com”)
Jim (as Kermit)
Well, um, Bryant, I rather enjoyed it, you see. As a young tadpole growing up in the swamp, I watched Mickey and Bugs like everyone else, so, um, it was a real joy for me to see them both together.
Bryant
Certainly. But you didn’t make an appearance.
Jim/Kermit
Gosh, Bryant, how old do you think I am? (audience laughs) (close up on Kermit) The movie is set in the late 1940s, and I really didn’t lose my tail until the ‘50s. But a couple of my usual Muppet Show guests were there. (cuts back to wide shot to reveal Statler and Waldorf sitting on the back of the couch; audience applauds)
Jim/Waldorf
Yes, I remember those days like they were yesterday…[7]
Richard Hunt/Statler
For you they were, you forgetful old fool! (laughs, Waldorf makes a face)
Roger
Gosh, yes, I r-r-remember you two! You didn’t t-t-treat my friends Donald and Daffy very nice!
Jim/Waldorf
What can I say, we weren’t very nice in our younger days.
Richard/Statler
And we aren’t very nice now! (both laugh)
Jim/Kermit
Good Grief.
Jane
Mr. Statler, Mr. Waldorf, what did you think of the movie?
Jim/Waldorf
Terrible!
Richard/Statler
Awful!
Jim/Waldorf
Miserable!
Richard/Statler
Dreadful!
Jim/Waldorf
Except for those two handsome young hecklers in the early second act!
Richard/Statler
Yes! More of those guys! (Statler and Waldorf laugh)
Bryant
(close up; laughing) Ladies and gentlemen, Statler and Waldorf! (applause)
Jim/Kermit
(cuts back to wide shot, only Kermit is there, Muppet-wise) Good grief, I have no idea why I keep letting those guys into the theater. They don’t even pay for their seats!
Jane
So, Mr. Gilliam, you have a new feature entering production with Fantasia Films, correct?
Terry
Yes, it’s called the Adventures of Baron von Munchhausen and it’s the third movie of my Trilogy of the Imagination along with Time Bandits, which was about childhood, and The Bureau, which is about adulthood. Baron von Munchausen is about old age. It’s produced by Bernie Brillstein, which, it turns out, has a special connection to the title character. His Uncle Jack, who inspired him to go into entertainment, used to play Baron von Munchausen on the radio[8].
Jim
Bernie was very excited to hear about the movie. He practically begged us to let him produce it.
Roger
Are there any p-p-p-parts for me?
Terry
Not for you, Harvey. (laughter)
Jane
(laughing) Well, with that we need to take a quick commercial break.
Bryant
Thank you, Roger, Jim, Terry, and Kermit! Coming up after the commercial break, we talk as always to my good friend Willard Scott. Hi Willard!
Exterior – Street Outside of the Today Show Set
Willard Scott stands by a group of excited, cheering fans. He smiles and waves. Statler peeks in from the left side of the screen and frowns. Theme song plays as the Title Card displays. Fade to commercial.
[1] Just as Roger’s look is informed by a combination of WB and Disney animation styles, Roger’s laugh in this timeline is a combination of Woody Woodpecker and Goofy.
[2] Tim Curry as Judge Doom will indeed be nightmare fuel, though he’s more like his appearance in Muppet Treasure Island than his appearance in It. This is a family movie.
[3] Will be a hit largely due to the clever characters, witty dialog, and crossover from so many different animation studios, but won’t be quite the massive breakout hit that it was in our timeline due to lacking some of the je ne se quoi of the OTL feature, which was lightning in a bottle, and having some of Gilliam’s quirkiness and pacing problems limit the mass appeal (fewer re-viewings). Eventually this timeline’s version will make over $200 million worldwide against a $50 million budget (even more on video) , which is notably less than in our timeline ($300 million+) but still a certifiable blockbuster.
[4] Or more accurately wouldn’t; Ron Miller wasn’t big on public appearances.
[5] Figuratively had to dispatch Sweetums in some cases.
[6] Unlike our timeline’s Richard Williams-animated characters, which took advantage of his singular genius in making 2D look 3D, the Disney Team has relied on the DATA machines to keep 3D proportions going.
[7] Take time to appreciate the fact that Jim is performing two Muppets right now.
[8] An interesting coincidence!
TomCurry as Doom? Sold already!
This Roger Rabbit sounds just as fun as the OTL one, though Bob will be missed, he does grumpy Everyman so well.
Henson doing 2 muppets at once on live TV with no screwups? Man was a genius!
Is there a Smash Brothers type or a mystery computer game coming from this movie?
Given the money Roger Rabbit seems to be making.... sequel?
Great work @Geekhis Khan
This Roger Rabbit sounds just as fun as the OTL one, though Bob will be missed, he does grumpy Everyman so well.
Henson doing 2 muppets at once on live TV with no screwups? Man was a genius!
Is there a Smash Brothers type or a mystery computer game coming from this movie?
Given the money Roger Rabbit seems to be making.... sequel?
Great work @Geekhis Khan
I've always found WFRR a bit too much creepy for my tastes, but nice stuff we've got here!
While Tim Curry as Judge Doom sounds great, it does make me increasingly wonder how Christopher Llyod’s career is going. Losing both of his iconic roles in Back to the Future and now Who Framed Roger Rabbit is probably not good for his career.
While we're at it, how's Charles Fleischer doing? I mean, doing the voice of Roger Rabbit is practically the only thing he's known for IOTL.
I'm sure he's fine.
I'll re-nominate Lloyd for the title role if Disney makes a Don Quixote film. I think he'd be fantastic as an elderly, off-his-rocker nobleman.
- Status